I hate skiing.

[Bored Of Education]

I can't think of a sport (outside of ones like polo or real tennis that only the upper classes play) that is so horribly middle-class. I don't really mean the Winter Olympics elite skiers so much - although I doubt that the participants have come from inner city skiing clubs - but the skiing as a participation sport.

I know of no other sport that accounts for so many days lost at school through holidays taken in school time ("because it's sooo expensive otherwise"). It is a sport partaken only by those that can afford two holidays a year - let's face it if you can only afford one, you don't go somewhere cold. It is a sport that pretty much every participant has to fly abroad for so it is damaging to the environment. Even at entry level, the equipment and clothing is prohibitively expensive for most of us.

This has nothing to do with the fact that I have so many drinking mates that do it that when they go into one about bloody skiing or snowboarding, I am left reading the wine list for seemingly hours. If that was the case, I would hate "Breaking Bad" also. It isn't the fact either that I had to listen to a 10 minute report on Radio 4 this morning about ski apps encouraging skiers to go too fast.

Actually, it may be those last two a little. Anyway, I have put out my reasoned evidence-based argument so prove me wrong, OTF, either by telling me what is good about skiing or what sports are more hateful.

[ad hoc]

I hate skiing.

I think your arguments that skiing is middle class are akin to those put forward that Rugby Union is middle class. Which is to say that in England it pretty much is middle class, whereas elsewhere, notably, your own country, it is not.

Likewise skiing. Yes for people in the Uk or any other mild country, it is a very middle class sport. But for people who live in cold places with a lot of snow it is by no means middle class.

[Bored Of Education]

I hate skiing.

Oh no, I get that. I should have excised people of France, Italy, Austria, Switzerland, the colder parts of the US and Canada from this, of course. It is pretty much the British middle classes that I am talking about. Especially the ones that blather on about it in my pub.

Obviously, I know what you mean about Rugby especially living in Bath. However, there is no getting away from the fact that anyone, especially kids, can and do start playing rugby at entry level pretty cheaply and without much expenditure on equipment, club fees or even coaching.

Similarly, the LTA has done a pretty good job on making tennis a reasonably accessible sport. Even if a kid wants to learn to ride a horse to a reasonable standard, they can do so fairly cheaply.

Outside of motor sport, skiing must be the most expensive and inaccessible to start. Even snowboarding isn't really as bad as, one snowy winter, Bored Jr bought a snowboard off his mate for £20 and was up on the golf course with his skateboarding helmet and pads.

[ad hoc]

I hate skiing.

If you live in an area where a lot of people ski, you can easily pick up second hand equipment for very little.

I mean, yes I know exactly what you mean. Growing up, it did seem like a hugely middle class sport, because the richer kids did it, and the cost seemed massive - equipment, ski passes, travel, hotels, etc and always seemingly in some of Europe's most expensive countries.

But now I live in a place in which everyone skis, where a ski lift pass can be incredibly cheap and where buying equipment is really very cheap. Cheaper by far than, say, a bike.

[Bored Of Education]

I hate skiing.

I realised when I walked home and saw hateful Bath residents playing pick-up games of rugby that it is actually that pick-up element of sport that is crucial.

Football, rugby, tennis, cricket, tennis, baseball, basketball, swimming, as I say, even horse-riding can all be done fairly quickly and cheaply.

I appreciate what you're saying, of course. If you live near snow, it is fairly easy and cheap to get into but there is something about a sport where most of the participants have to fly to take part.

Actually, I scuba dive so what am I talking about?

[ursus arctos]

I hate skiing.

I seriously doubt whether most of the people who ski in the Alps fly there.

Obviously, the Brits, Russians and North Americans generally do, but they represent a rather small percentage of the total number of skiers on any given hill over the corse of a season.

The same is true of ski areas in the Northeast US, Canada or California. The only places that I can think of the top of my head where it may not be true are some of the most exclusive resorts in Colorado or Utah and heli-skiing resorts.

[Seven Saxon Kings]

I hate skiing.

It seems a bit unfair to hate a sport mainly because we aren't blessed with the geography to make it accessible.

[VTTBoscombe]

I hate skiing.

I am lucky today to live somewhere where skiing is easily reached, and if you shop around, can be done at good value even for families of 5.
In fact when we first came over here, to see ski lifts after only a 30' drive was really freaky and (to us ) fantastic.
But even when I lived in the UK, we often coached to the Alps, to save money (and maximise slope time).
We met loads of people who did it on a budget. Whether they qualify as Middle Class or Working class - I have no idea; but these were people who if they had one holiday a year would make damn sure it was skiiing not the Costa del whatever.
I am still like that today - unfortunately my wife is not and wants her sun/warm weather - huh I can sun bath in the garden.

Of course there is still a lot of Chalet Girls fresh from the poney club and hurrahs that are crawling over the resorts too.

Those ski apps are like Strava in cycling, rather open to abuse, and impossible to police.

[Reed John]

I hate skiing.

It seems to be very popular among ponces, and there are a few resorts that are very exclusive, but people who live near a ski area can get into it for fairly cheap. Perhaps not poor people but middle-class-by-our-understanding-of-middle-class, including working people, can find a way to make it work if it's something they really want to do.*

I started skiing on our local hill when was 11 or 12. I got the boots cheap at a garage sale and the rest at a used ski sale. Of course, that made me less cool than the kids whose parents bought them nicer stuff (and themsevles even nicer stuff) but I could go down the hill just as fast as most of them, so who cares? The season pass was kind of expensive, like $200, so that had to be a combination of paper route money and birthday present.

After a few years, I got bored of it and decided I wanted to spend my money on comics and music.

A lot of people find a job that comes with a free lift-ticket. Two of my good friends paid for their habit in high school by becoming instructors and managed to later get jobs teaching at major resorts in Colorado, New Zealand, and BC. Another friend of mine teaches the kids racing team and officiates races. Some other friends of mine can get free admission to lots of places by working as the safety patrol. They can just show up and volunteer to help out and then ski for free.

*Likewise, motor sports aren't really a posh thing in the US. Obviously, the team owners are - but that's true in every sport - but most of the drivers started out with modest means racing go karts and on dirt tracks. That's not cheap either, but if it's a priority, even somebody on a modest wage can find a way to pay for that.

[alyxandr]

I hate skiing.

You strap boards onto your feet and slide down a hill as fast as you can; and if you fall down, you don't die,^* but get up, brush the snow out of your eyebrows, and keep going, plus incredible views. Skiing is one of the most awesome things evar, and anyone who doesn't think so is either a classist, jealous, afraid of a little velocity, or some linear combination of those things.

_{* usually}

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

It's the famous (should that be infamous?) Wengen Lauberhorn downhill on Ski Sunday tonight at 6pm, the fastest race of the season. And, just for Bored, a snowboarding event too.

No spoilers, but there are now four skiers within 20 points of each other at the top of the men's downhill World Cup standings before they go to Kitzbuhel next week (you get 100 for winning a race, 80 for 2nd and 60 for 3rd), it's all very exciting. The winter olympic downhill gold next month will inevitably be won by none of those four but by an unknown yank ranked 30th.

[Sporting]

It seems to be very popular among ponces

What do you mean by ponces?

[Hot Pepsi]

I don’t know. I wrote that years ago.

In the US, skiing is mostly a middle-class or rich person’s sport. The gear, instruction, and the lift tickets are expensive and the mountains generally aren’t very close to cities so you usually have to pay to get there and stay there.

I skied at our local hill as a kid, but I lost interest and I haven’t skied in 30 years. It just wasn’t remotely convenient or affordable. I also reached a plateau of skill such that to get noticeably better would have required a lot of practice, instruction and danger.

I’ve thought about getting back into it, but the snow is so inconsistent here now. Climate change.

I like watching it on TV.

[San Bernardhinault]

We went to see the in-laws again yesterday and popped by to have a look at the small ski-mountain a mile away. The missus waxed a bit nostalgic. She worked there as a kid and as a result got to ski for free as much as she wanted (when there was snow there). It was actually a perfect snow-making day yesterday. Bitterly cold, but sunny. The parking lot was packed, despite it being four short runs on a small hill in the middle of Connecticut.

It reminded me that, for people who actually live where the snow is, it's not a rich wankers sport. It's a fun thing to do in winter that gets you outside.

Meanwhile, I am reminded again that skiing isn't really for me. I enjoy about 4 hours on the bunny slopes on easy skis, about once every two or three years, then I get bored. I don't want to hurtle down steep hills, have no great love of adrenaline, nor any real desire to mash my knees up learning new skills to make me better at it. It's wasted on me.

[caja-dglh]

What do you mean by ponces?

asking for a clarification 8 years on might lift Sporting above TonTon in the rankings!

[Janik]

Well, to answer this point of Bored's from 8 years ago, it is decades since I went on a holiday in the summer. Because I will always completely prioritise going somewhere cold and hilly instead. The mountains in winter beat anything warm places could possibly offer hands down.
But then I would rather chew my own arm off than go on a beach holiday, even if I wasn't spending all my annual holiday money on a ski trips. Beach holidays sound completely turgid and dull.

[Janik]

And the Alps are within a car journey of Britain. That was how my family generally used to get there each year. Just pick somewhere two-thirds of the way down to spend a night in to break the journey and it works perfectly comfortably.

[jason voorhees]

When I describe my older brother in one sentence, it's "he taught blind people how to ski."

[ursus arctos]

It reminded me that, for people who actually live where the snow is, it's not a rich wankers sport. It's a fun thing to do in winter that gets you

This is universally true in my experience, even more so in Europe where the costs tend to be lower (season tickets are cheap if one goes every weekend and often subsidised for locals, while good used equipment is ubiquitous).

It is a very intrinsic part of life in the Alps and something that one starts as early as 3. In that way, it is not unlike cycling in the Netherlands or Flanders, though cycling doesn't provide anywhere near the opportunities for casual employment.

[Amor de Cosmos]

In the US, skiing is mostly a middle-class or rich person’s sport. The gear, instruction, and the lift tickets are expensive and the mountains generally aren’t very close to cities so you usually have to pay to get there and stay there.

Downhill skiing tends to be expensive, especially if you want the big runs and apres-ski nonsense. If you live where there are mountains (puts hand up) then the cost varies enormously. Around here Whistler/Garabaldi is a major tourist destination with Olympic runs and so priced accordingly. But, overlooking Vancouver there are three more modest ski-hills that aren't prohibitively expensive And, of course, cross-country skiing won't cost you anything except the gear.

[Hot Pepsi]

Yeah, it’s a bit like tennis in that the culture that’s grown up around it makes it seem more exclusive than it needs to be.

A lot of very good skiers start out at small hills in the east or Midwest. Lindsey Vonn, for example. But they have to go somewhere bigger, with better conditions, to pursue it properly.

I just discovered than my friend for whom things always go well has a house in Crested Butte. So maybe I can go out there sometime and try skiing in good western snow.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Blimey. Ski Sunday's going to go into meltdown. Dave Ryding from Leyland's only gone and won the Kitzbuhel slalom.

[Janik]

He has been in the hunt for that for a few years, with previous podiums. If I remember correct there was one race where he led after the first run, but then missed a gate pushing to convert that to a win, which he has seemed en route to doing as his lead was going up rather than down. In Are in Sweden, maybe. Anyway, it's not an out-of-the-blue result, but as the first ever Brit* to win a World Cup level race it is a significant day for the British ski team.
* - previous best was Konrad Bartelski's second in Val Gardena (which Ryding had matched), which had the produced an infamous incredulous piece of commentary from French TV, "Ce n'est pas possible! C'est un anglais", when it was clear Bartleski was in with a chance of victory (in fact he probably should have won - he made a mistake right at the end that probably cost him first).

[Stumpy Pepys]

I had to learn skiing at the tender age of 39. Living in Munich, it's only an hour's drive to the nearest slope; it's kind of socially awkward if you don't ski to be honest.

Agreed it's a middle-class pastime, but ti's not only for posh folk.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Ski Sunday starts again tonight on BBC2, at 5-15, again with the Wengen classic downhill. I'll stick it on at halftime in the footy. I never get over the thrill of watching these mad buggers hurtle down mountains at 70mph.