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    Tennis - general 2024 thread

    Nerdy statto post here:

    I just noticed, from the numbers in the "Live ATP rankings" website, that for 2024 the ATP have adjusted their ranking points system a little, bringing it marginally closer to the WTA's system in terms of giving more points than it used to for achievements short of winning a title, relative to title winner points. For several years ATP tournaments have been based on a doubling from 45 points for reaching R2 of a slam up to 720 for reaching a slam SF, then 1200 for the losing finalist. Now the doubling starts with 50 for reaching R2 up to 800 for reaching a slam semi, with 1300 for the losing finalist. Other tournaments halved/quartered/eighthed (with rounding) from there.

    Early rounds still count for significantly less than under the WTA system (unchanged this year for Slams) where you get 70 points for reaching a slam R2, and the progression is very slightly sub-doubling until you get 780 for reaching a SF (at which point now, for the first time, WTA points are snow slightly less than the new ATP points reward of 800), then 1300 for the losing finalists.

    The WTA have made a change of a different kind to their points system for 2024: in place of the utterly bizarre pretty random scaling of tournaments (2000, 1000, 900, 470 and 280 for the champion), they are now doing some easy to remember halving, quartering and eighth-ing, as the ATP have long done.

    Oddly, the Wikipedia page on ATP rankings has not, at the time of writing, been updated to reflect the ATP's changes. That surely won't be the case for long, as those kind of pages tend to be rapidly updated by a community of people who are as nerdy as me but also have basic IT user skills.

    #2
    In the absence of any posts about actual tennis, and with contributions only from me, this will languish as a thread for occasional nerdy statto stuff.

    Today's statto observation: there is some amusing national bunching right now in the seeding echelons of the "live" WTA singles rankings, which I assume will be mirrored precisely in the actual official rankings on Monday morning, as that's what the live rankings are supposed to mean, once all relevant players have exited any current tournament.

    Specifically, on this coming Monday:

    - the top 3 Czech women will be ranked 8, 10 and 11. (edit: I vaguely recall that there has at some point in the last year or two been a larger number of Czech women - perhaps as many as five - simultaneously in the 6 to 12 space or thereabouts, it's a country with an astonishing output of top female tennis players, so of course Noskova's hero is apparently Serena Williams!)

    - the top 3 Russian women will be ranked 14, 15 and 16; and

    - Ukrainian women will have places 28, 29, 31 and 32.
    Last edited by Evariste Euler Gauss; 25-01-2024, 17:37.

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      #3
      Originally posted by Evariste Euler Gauss View Post
      In the absence of any posts about actual tennis, and with contributions only from me, this will languish as a thread for occasional nerdy statto stuff.
      I'm reading if not contributing.

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        #4
        Yet another R1 loss for Murray. Yet again a loss after going 1 set up. And to a lower ranked opponent (Paire). Depressing.

        On the other hand, Boulter's win in R1 of a 500 tournament against a higher ranked opponent (Paolini) pushes her to a new live ranking high (no.45) with potential for yet further improvement. She must be hoping she can make it into the seeding positions by the French and Wimbledon.

        Raducanu is not playing this week. At number 293 or thereabouts in the rankings, she has a hell of a lot to do to get back into the picture.

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          #5
          Originally posted by Evariste Euler Gauss View Post
          Yet another R1 loss for Murray. Yet again a loss after going 1 set up. And to a lower ranked opponent (Paire). Depressing.

          On the other hand, Boulter's win in R1 of a 500 tournament against a higher ranked opponent (Paolini) pushes her to a new live ranking high (no.45) with potential for yet further improvement. She must be hoping she can make it into the seeding positions by the French and Wimbledon.

          Raducanu is not playing this week. At number 293 or thereabouts in the rankings, she has a hell of a lot to do to get back into the picture.
          A loss against Paire is particularly grim. Paire’s recent history had involved a series of injuries and lack of form that had seen him drop down to Challenger level to regain form, with little success. He’s much better known for showmanship than as a committed pro these days.

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            #6
            A good win for Raducanu against Bouzkova yesterday in R1 of the Abu Dhabi 500-level tournament, 4 and 1. Interesting challenge for her in R2, I assume tomorrow, when she will face Jabeur. I think Raducanu has still never beaten a top 10 opponent (having famously won her US Open title in 2021 without having to face anyone seeded higher than 11).

            I don't fancy Watson's chances against Kudermetova today in R1 of the same tournament.

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              #7
              I was interested to read that some people make a decent living from the Challenger circuit, enough to keep going for 17-20 years. It's also a route into Slams, although you'd have to play a lot of matches.

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                #8
                Originally posted by Evariste Euler Gauss View Post
                A good win for Raducanu against Bouzkova yesterday in R1 of the Abu Dhabi 500-level tournament, 4 and 1. Interesting challenge for her in R2, I assume tomorrow, when she will face Jabeur. I think Raducanu has still never beaten a top 10 opponent (having famously won her US Open title in 2021 without having to face anyone seeded higher than 11).

                I don't fancy Watson's chances against Kudermetova today in R1 of the same tournament.
                Watson won in straight sets. That must be her best performance in years.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                  I was interested to read that some people make a decent living from the Challenger circuit, enough to keep going for 17-20 years. It's also a route into Slams, although you'd have to play a lot of matches.
                  Yes the likes of Liam Brody, who’s 30 now, has spent most of his career on the Futures/Challengers circuit. He raised his profile by making the third round of Wimbledon a couple of years ago having been given a wild card entry (a huge benefit that British, French, US and Australian lower ranked players are given annually) but has since gone back to Challengers. He’s not untypical, although lots of players drift away from the game when they realise they are not going to be good enough to compete regularly at ATP top level events and gain the points/prize money/endorsements that are needed to make a decent living.

                  I had a copy of this book a few years ago and it made fascinating reading on this subject.

                  https://www.amazon.co.uk/Chasing-Poi.../dp/1785313835

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by multipleman78 View Post

                    Watson won in straight sets. That must be her best performance in years.
                    Wow, that's great. And a great reverse jinx by me. I'll let Heather take the credit, though. [insert smiley thing]

                    Edit: i have to say, I hadn't spotted that Watson had beaten Kenin in qualifying for the event, which might have alerted me to her being on very good form just right now.
                    Last edited by Evariste Euler Gauss; 06-02-2024, 17:22.

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                      #11
                      Murray out at the first hurdle in the Marseilles Open, beaten in straight sets by Machac.

                      When Bublik won in Montpellier over the weekend he apparently became the first player to win an ATP tour title having lost the first set of each match in tournament.

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                        #12
                        Bright signs for the future of British women's tennis? No doubt this is less significant than it looks, and possibly due mainly to varying practice around the world re the entry of junior players into adult tournaments rather than a genuine pre-eminence of the UK in the age cohort, but for what it's worth Britain currently has 2 of the top 4 players worldwide in the WTA adult rankings aged under 16 (and the top two in the world aged under 15 and a half), namely the 14 year old Hannah Klugman (live ranking at the time of writing no. 641, following her R2 exit from a Roehampton tournament), and Mika Stojsavljevic (live ranking now 863, following her QF exit from the same tournament, which almost doubled her ranking points and pushed her up 170 places).

                        Meanwhile Heather Watson has reached the SFs of that tournament and is the highest ranked/seeded player left in it. Stojsavlevic in R2 beat the player who beat the number 1 seed in R1.

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                          #13
                          On the very good ‘Tennis Unfiltered’ podcast a few weeks ago I was surprised to hear Calvin Betton - who doesn’t give praise away - speaking very effusively about Hannah Klugman.

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                            #14
                            What a display from Katie Boulter in San Diego. She took out four seeds during the week and stormed to the title with ferocious ball striking.

                            She will now reside inside the top 30.

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                              #15
                              Yes, very impressive from Boulter, and great that she's now in the top 30 and will be seeded in majors as a result, for a while at least.

                              There's a piece on her progress by Tumaini Carayol in today's Guardian which is generally a good read, apart from an irritating error where the writer asserts (pending any corrective editing of the online version) that Boulter "will head to Indian Wells as a seeded player". In fact she is not seeded at Indian Wells, because her ranking is only high enough from today, and the seedings for a tournament are always fixed in the week prior to the start of the tournament, when (in this case) her ranking was not yet high enough.

                              Quietly impressive Boulter has finally converted learnings into winning tennis | Tennis | The Guardian
                              Last edited by Evariste Euler Gauss; 04-03-2024, 23:24.

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                                #16
                                Boulter hasn't suffered too much, draw-wise, from not being seeded. Giorgi in R1 then if she wins that, seed number 26 Noskova.i R2 (although, as a fast-rising youngster, I dare say Noskova is stronger than her seeding at 26 implies).. If she can beat Noskova, Swiatek awaits in R3, but that could have happened even if Boulter had been seeded at her new ranking level.

                                Meanwhile, Dart just needs to win one more match in order to qualify.

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                                  #17
                                  After that impressive and morale boosting tournament win at the weekend that’s a hugely disappointing straight sets defeat for Boulter in the first round at Indian Wells.

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                                    #18
                                    Time to recover in time for Miami!

                                    Draper out in R1 too. At least Murray gets a win, but he has to face Rublev in R2.

                                    I wonder how wild card Emma "not too bothered about tournament results" Raducanu, current live ranking 340, will get on in R1 tonight.

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                                      #19
                                      Decent win, although she made harder work of it than was maybe necessary, Masarova was going to pieces early in the second set but grew back into the game and Raducanu needed four match points to finish it. No.30 seed up next for her.

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                                        #20
                                        Kokkinakis, who had a very decent first round victory, comes across Sinner and loses 6-3, 6-0, winning only five points in the second set. Sinner hasn’t lost for five months. He’s in the form of a lifetime.

                                        Another solid win for De Minaur who’s in very good form also.

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                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by Tony C View Post
                                          Kokkinakis, who had a very decent first round victory, comes across Sinner and loses 6-3, 6-0, winning only five points in the second set. Sinner hasn’t lost for five months. He’s in the form of a lifetime.

                                          Another solid win for De Minaur who’s in very good form also.
                                          Hmm. Sinner is indeed in great form, but his run isn't that impressive yet. His last defeat was in the final of the ATP Finals, a week shy of 4 months ago. Since then he has now accrued 16 consecutive wins - 3 in the Davis Cup immediately after last year's ATP Finals, then 7 in the Aussie Open, 5 at Rotterdam and 1 so far at Indian Wells. A good run already, and still counting of course, but hardly exceptional by the standards of slam winners.

                                          Raducanu won her R2 match against Yastremska when the latter pulled out of the match with ER 4-0 up in set 1. R3 she meets Sabalenka, a challenge of a much greater order. I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, that ER has never beaten an opponent ranked in the top 10 at the time of playing her.

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                                            #22
                                            That is correct.

                                            I thought Murray looked very good for 90 minutes against Rublev but having got zero reward for his efforts, he seemed to just deflate and exit with a whimper.

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                                              #23
                                              Signs that Djokovic may be a waning force - a loss in the Aussie SFs followed by a humiliating exit to a player ranked outside the top 100 at Indian Wells. The next year or two of slams may be carved up between Alcaraz, Sinner and Medvedev.

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                                                #24
                                                The Sinner/Alcaraz semi final has just started at Indian Wells. I’d love to be watching it.

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                                                  #25
                                                  Sabalenka's boyfriend, former NHL player Konstantin Koltsov has died aged 42,apparently by suicide

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