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Philandophilia: England in South Africa 2019-20

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    Originally posted by Capybara View Post

    I didn't notice the precise timing of the declaration, but that can be a factor. Declaring on 499 means South Africa need to score 300 to avoid the possibility of following on, which might have a slight psychological effect.
    It's all a bit mind games and based around the so-called importance of 100, 200, 300 etc.

    It would be better, wouldn't it, as a batsman, getting out seven times out of ten in the nineties than occasionally getting a ton but being dismissed regularly for low scores? We are too obsessed - me included - by these nice round numbers, in all walks of life, not just cricket.

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      I haven't been listening to TMS for this test - where I would expect to find this kind of information - but there cannot have been many designated number 11 test batsmen with a test 169 or more to their name, as Stuart Broad is here.

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        That's true, but it's the Stuart Broad who has averaged 12 with the bat over the last five years since being hit on the head.

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          Again, true. His test average overall is down only 18.5 now. A lot of ducks in his test career - 35 out of around 200 test innings.

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            New record today for slowest Test innings, i.e. SR in minimum 110 balls:

            http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...g;view=innings

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              Not the greatest start to the day.

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                All bowled as well.

                South Africa must have been thinking they could avoid the follow on and possibly sneak a draw. That's al gone now.

                Only rain can save them now.

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                  The wheels have truly come off South African cricket. Very sad and worrying given we've already seen West Indies and Pakistan go through turmoil and never fully recover.

                  This is to take nothing away from England who have been ruthless in keeping the boot on the throat.

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                    Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                    New record today for slowest Test innings, i.e. SR in minimum 110 balls:

                    http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...g;view=innings
                    It's stuff like that that glues me to Wisden for hours on end. I'm sure fans of baseball may differ in their opinion, but there is no sport quite so statistically rich as cricket.

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                      Root has 4 wickets. Wtf is going on?

                      ​​

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                        Root is a little more than an 'occasional' spinner, hence England didn't feel the need to drop a seamer to add another spin specialist (Parkinson) to work alongside Bess on a wicket expected to turn. However this return is unexpectedly good.

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                          Heard on the radio today that Root has been working really hard on his bowling. Seems to be working.

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                            Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                            The wheels have truly come off South African cricket. Very sad and worrying given we've already seen West Indies and Pakistan go through turmoil and never fully recover.

                            This is to take nothing away from England who have been ruthless in keeping the boot on the throat.
                            There have been times like that in the past. I see no reason why SA won't recover in due course. There is a transition going on, and things will probably remain dire for a while yet. But it's always been a story of highs and troughs with SA (as it is with England).

                            The story is different for the other two: Pakistan has been hurt by being exiled from their own country, and the West Indies by other codes attracting sporting talents.

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                              Over 80 so far for the last wicket!

                              Only England.

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                                Great rearguard action from Kesh Maharaj though. I mean, it's totally in vain, but you still love to see it.

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                                  Saffers a/o for 237, putting on 99 for the last wicket.

                                  England win by an innings and 53 runs.

                                  What an odd series this is turning out to be.

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                                    Originally posted by Tony C View Post

                                    It's stuff like that that glues me to Wisden for hours on end. I'm sure fans of baseball may differ in their opinion, but there is no sport quite so statistically rich as cricket.
                                    Well I was amazed, when listening to the most recent Infinite Inning baseball podcast, that MLB provides about 100 columns of data for every pitch.

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                                      And on that note. I do think Cricket is years and years behind baseball when it comes to public statistical analysis. Not only in the way that Cricket has only just started recording the data but also in how it's used publicly for very little beyond database dives for freak occurrences and sequence records.

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                                        Originally posted by Ray de Galles after England's innings View Post
                                        I wonder if England will even need to bat again.
                                        You people just have no faith.

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                                          Originally posted by Ray de Galles View Post

                                          You people just have no faith.
                                          If I'm honest I was feeling that an innings win was on the cards when the openers were still in at lunch on day one. I just didn't want to put it in writing...

                                          I think we still have question marks over number 3, in particular, but otherwise I think we're in a decent place at the moment. Denly is a bit too slow and cautious. We'd kind of needed a slow and steady number 3 when we were going through the various combinations of openers who were getting out too quickly. If (and it is still an 'if' I suppose) the openers can survive most if not all of the first session then we need a technically gifted scorer at number three. For me, the player who fits that bill could be James Vince again, and being left-handed he'd complement Root well when we need a third wicket stand.

                                          Root, Stokes, Pope, Buttler is shaping up nicely though. I think England have decided now that Bairstow and Buttler can only compete for the same place in the team; you can't crowbar them both in to the Test XI.
                                          Last edited by Kevin S; 20-01-2020, 10:53.

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                                            Originally posted by Kevin S View Post

                                            If I'm honest I was feeling that an innings win was on the cards when the openers were still in at lunch on day one. I just didn't want to put it in writing...
                                            Oh, it's entirely that reluctance to "say it out loud" that I was alluding to with the comment about a lack of faith. I'm not claiming any particular powers of foresight on my behalf, I'm sure a lot of people were expecting the same but didn't want to curse it.

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                                              Oh that's a fair cop. I said it to a colleague though at least.

                                              FWIW the scoring from the prediction game was:

                                              Antepli Ejderha = 25 points
                                              Match result: SA win (0 points)
                                              Chosen batter (first innings): Denley (25 points)
                                              Chosen bowler (first innings): Philander (0 points)
                                              South Africa first innings score: 300-349 (0 points)
                                              England first innings score: 250-299 (0 points)

                                              Kevin S = 120 points
                                              Match result: England win (40 points)
                                              Chosen batter (first innings): Elgar (35 points)
                                              Chosen bowler (first innings): Broad (3x15 = 45 points)
                                              South Africa first innings score: 250-299 (0 points)
                                              England first innings score: 250-299 (0 points)

                                              The win was there for the taking just for picking Ollie Pope as the batter.... I'll try to remember to bump it before the final Test, though feel free to just stick up your predictions at any point before the toss on Friday morning as the things to predict are always the same.

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                                                Originally posted by Levin View Post

                                                Well I was amazed, when listening to the most recent Infinite Inning baseball podcast, that MLB provides about 100 columns of data for every pitch.
                                                Perhaps a subject for another thread, but it is worth making clear that this degree of detail is quite new, having only been available in any fashion since 2006 (when Pitch F/X was introduced for the postseason) and become comprehensive in 2015 with the introduction of Statcast and Trackman.

                                                As of the 90s, there were still massive gaps in the availability of accurate scoresheets for games played before 1960 and we will never have basic information like pitch counts for historical games, as it simply wasn't recorded.

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                                                  Originally posted by Kevin S View Post
                                                  I think England have decided now that Bairstow and Buttler can only compete for the same place in the team; you can't crowbar them both in to the Test XI.
                                                  It seems to me that Buttler's batting form is even worse than Bairstow's at the minute. If they're going to have a wicketkeeper who doesn't score any runs, they might as well have Foakes (much as I love Bairstow)

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                                                    Yeah, can't argue with that. Buttler might be white-ball only before long in fact.

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