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    AFL

    The most recent thread I could find was entitled AFL 2008. So I've started a new one. I'm in Melbourne and tonight is Richmond vs Geelong in the first semi final (I don't think they call it that it's something more like mini final) of this year's AFL. The streets are full of climate protestors and "footy" fans. I have no idea which team is predicted to win but I imagine the city will be lit up (especially if Richmond win). I'd love to go. Not really a fan of the sport but would love to see a game live

    #2
    I saw a game live (Adelaide Crows vs Gold Coast Suns) earlier this season and it's bloody great. I'm hooked. It's a weird mix of complete randomness and sublime skill.

    Preliminary Final, apparently. The playoff structure is confusing.

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      #3
      I've had a soft spot for Aussie Rules ever since channel 4 first showed the season finale playoffs in about 1982. As a result I can probably name six or seven suburbs of Melbourne despite never having been there - Carlton, Hawthorn, Essendon, Collingwood, Footscray, Fitzroy, St Kilda, South Melbourne, there you go.

      The playoff system isn't that complicated, it's a double eliminator system favouring sides who've finished higher in the regular season, and the one adopted and adapted by Super League here.

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        #4
        I got really into AFL around the turn of the century - a friend of mine went over to Australia and brought back AFL 99 on the Playstation so we were both hooked on it.

        I haven't watched it for about 10-15 years though. When I do stumble across it though, I find it truly engrossing.

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          #5
          The growth and expansion of the AFL is an example to competitions like the NRL and A-League.

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            #6
            It used to be on ESPN in the early 80s. Not sure what, if any, cable channel has it now, but I sometimes see the highlights on YouTube. My cousin in Melbourne married a die hard Carlton Blues fan, so I guess that's my team.

            I'd like to see it live. It's kinda hard to follow on TV since the field is huge and there are so many players.

            So many of the teams in Victoria play in the same stadiums away from their historic homes. Not sure how they maintain a community identity that way.

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              #7
              But they really do. The devotion of Melburnian "Rules" fans is quasi-religious. In most cities of the world there will be elements of the populace not interested in the local teams of whatever sport. Not in Melbourne. I could do without the awful team songs though.

              As Snake said, watching live is just a totally different experience to the TV. I don't mind it on the TV, but live it's all the off-the-ball movement which you notice. Although there is a huge amount of it to try and keep track of.

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                #8
                Originally posted by Sits View Post
                The growth and expansion of the AFL is an example to competitions like the NRL and A-League.
                RL almost destroyed itself in the Super League War, and the hundreds of millions of dollars lost to the game could have propped up a decent expansion plan which had already started but now it's years behind the AFL and will never catch up. As the article suggests V/AFL made a head start by establishing a team in Sydney in the early 80s while the at the time the NSWRL was only just daring to reach Wollongong and Canberra. Also get the impression that the VFL was more commercially minded at the time, for example they were involved in World Series Cricket not long before that.

                I've never followed it enough to appreciate the finer points, but have seen a game live (Brisbane v Carlton) and enjoyed it as a spectacle.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by Sits View Post
                  But they really do. The devotion of Melburnian "Rules" fans is quasi-religious. In most cities of the world there will be elements of the populace not interested in the local teams of whatever sport. Not in Melbourne. I could do without the awful team songs though.

                  As Snake said, watching live is just a totally different experience to the TV. I don't mind it on the TV, but live it's all the off-the-ball movement which you notice. Although there is a huge amount of it to try and keep track of.
                  They do now, but will Melbourne be able to support so many teams in the future when none of the fans remember when the team actually played in their neighborhood?

                  In his biography, Peter Garrett says he likes the vibe of AFL a lot more than NRL, even though he's from Sydney. He went to university in Canberra and met more AFL fans there. I'm not sure why Canberra doesn't have its own team.

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                    #10
                    If the Victorians I know and their kids are any evidence that is not a problem at all.

                    Allegiances run much deeper than proximity.

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                      #11
                      They have a draft and a salary cap, I believe, so that helps prevent any one team from dominating and taking all the young glory hunter fans.

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                        #12
                        It's an interesting point about Canberra. From memory, North Melbourne Kangaroos play a game or two there each year, and/or Wagga Wagga which is southern country NSW.

                        As if to illustrate the success of the expansion, Greater Western Sydney Giants - one of the two newest teams - just best Collingwood to reach their first Grand Final.

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                          #13
                          It seems like a game in which the momentum can swing heavily. In both semi finals this weekend this happened. In the first match Geelong were all over Richmond in the first half (especially in the second quarter), but the second half was all Richmond and they won comfortably. In the other game the first 3 quarters were all Western Sydney but in the 4th Collingwood came roaring back and nearly nicked it.

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                            #14
                            We went to see Sydney Swans v Brisbane Lions in a semi/preliminary final game at the Homebush Olympic Stadium, probably about fifteen years ago. Sydney were a decent team but Brisbane were in their pomp, featuring (captain?) Michael Voss and supremely gifted bad boy Jason Akermanis. At three quarter time it was all square, then Brisbane ran away by 42 points.

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                              #15
                              What do hardcore Melbourne fans think of the expansion teams? I guess I sort of imagine that in the old days the competition was a bit like the Palio in Siena. Neighbourhoods vieing for annual supremacy. But now, while there are still multiple local derbies every year there is a fair chance that the final will feature at least one non Victoria team, and sometimes two. Isn't that kind of annoying?

                              RL fans I know in Sydney loathe the Melbourne Storm for example far more than they do Brisbane and NQueensland (though this "outsider" not real RL status is possibly compounded by the fact that (a) they're well funded and successful and (b) they're sort of seen as a Queensland team that happens to play in Melbourne. This fact (b) is presumably why fans in Brisbane are much less negative about them)

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                                #16
                                I think it's also partly down to them being schooled in the arts of shithousery from quite early in their existence. Assorted illegal tackles are associated with originating at the Storm.

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                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by Sits View Post
                                  It's an interesting point about Canberra. From memory, North Melbourne Kangaroos play a game or two there each year, and/or Wagga Wagga which is southern country NSW.

                                  As if to illustrate the success of the expansion, Greater Western Sydney Giants - one of the two newest teams - just best Collingwood to reach their first Grand Final.
                                  And how did Hawthorn develop as the AFL team associated with Tasmania, rather than the island itself launching an expansion team?

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                                    #18
                                    Mark O'Connor seems to be developing well at Geelong, although he has been making fewer headlines than Tadhg Kennelly, as the AFL was free-to-air here while the latter was in his prime.

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                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Sits View Post
                                      I think it's also partly down to them being schooled in the arts of shithousery from quite early in their existence. Assorted illegal tackles are associated with originating at the Storm.
                                      There was also the salary cap / dual contracts scandal. They were by no means the only ones to get caught on this front but they kept it going for longer, with more spectacular results on the pitch, than anyone else and it added fuel to the view that they are/were a fake club (which was also fuelled by them being propped up by News Ltd, and maybe they still are, I've lost track).

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                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Diable Rouge View Post

                                        And how did Hawthorn develop as the AFL team associated with Tasmania, rather than the island itself launching an expansion team?
                                        There's a bit of this goes on in League too, with clubs associating themselves with other areas (sometimes very remote from where they are based, such as South Sydney taking home games to Perth). Guess Hawthorn got there first (although for some reason I thought Geelong had a Tasmania connection too).

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                                          #21
                                          I read that there is some talk of a Hobart expansion team. Maybe a team in New Zealand too.

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                                            #22
                                            Most AFL teams in Melbourne retain their traditional neighbourhood home ground as a training and reserve team base, which helps keep the club rooted in their traditional suburb as well as meaning there's a bunch of cool heritage listed stands all over Melbourne.

                                            Remarkably, the Sydney Swans have held on to a substantial number of fans in their traditional home of South Melbourne - they have over 12,000 members in Victoria and have a notable number of away fans at most games in Melbourne. Brisbane Lions have been somewhat less successful, although not entirely unsuccessful.

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                                              #23
                                              I don't understand how people continue to support teams that abandoned them.

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                                                #24
                                                I think they at least tried not to completely disenfranchise their old homes. Both Sydney and Brisbane pay conscious tribute to their old identities. In a small visual way too with the old club's initials on the rear collar of their shirts. I don't know how many Fitzroy or South Melbourne fans switched to new teams.

                                                As for Footscray becoming Western Bulldogs I'm guessing that was less of an issue as they stayed in Melbourne.

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                                                  #25
                                                  Keeping the old uniform doesn't matter. They left their old fans to find new ones.

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