Cricket World Cup 2019

[ursus arctos]

I was just looking at the app, and it does appear to be all over the place

The Cricinfo Page is more straightforward and easier to follow

[Hot Pepsi]

Is it supposed to be first-batter on top?

[ursus arctos]

That is how they show it, yes.

There isn't really a "should" as far as I know.

[Janik]

OK, so Kohli walking after having edged it or not makes me wonder how reliable the ultraedge technology is. Because i) the ball looks in the slow-mo like it deviates off the toe of the bat and ii) Kohli surely wouldn't have walked if he hadn't felt a nick on the ball. If he had stood his ground, been given out and then reviewed, he would presumably have been reprieved by DRS.
BBC replay here:- https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/cricket/48655110

As an aside, the Tennis tournament I was watching today were using a different challenge technology to hawkeye called RealView or something like that. It showed the actual ball bounce using high speed cameras positioned down the lines. And on the screen giving the replay was the legend "No Estimations" which was an interesting bit of shade to send towards it's rival system. But it does throw up a question about how reliable and accurate all of these ball tracking, edge detection etc. things actually are.

[Satchmo Distel]

I can't access BBC from here but the replay I have suggests he did not hit it:

https://indianexpress.com/article/sp...istan-5783378/

[ursus arctos]

Also 3:15 in on the official highlights

[George C.]

He didn't.

Still irrelevant now.

[Ray de Galles]

The detailed explanation/theory on Sky was thar Kohli's bat has taken a knock earlier in the innings that had left it making a clicking noise from the splice when it was swung in a certain manner. Evidently this is what Kohli heard and thought it was a noise of a nick on the ball.

They illustrated this with lots of shots of Kohli swishing the bat in the dressing room to recreate the sound and getting incredibly angry when it appeared to confirm the source of the noise. Dhoni then tried it himself for a while. It was quite a slapstick scene.

[Ray de Galles]

The offical cricket world cup mobile has the India-Pakistan game listed one way on the front page, but the other way when you click through to get the match report. Or it did an hour ago.

In all tournament finals you'll get fixtures listed with one side as the "home" one (the left hand side of the v or top line) and one the "away" (on the right or bottom) though that doesn't really denote anything (apart from maybe precedent in first kit in some cases) other than the order they came out of the fixture computer.

The fixtures & results page of the CWC and BBC sites lists South Africa before Afghanistan even though they batted second and Australia after Sri Lanka even though they batted first. Reports will list them in batting order for ease of understanding as they're retrospective.

[Greenlander]

Impressive.

Thanks.

How do they retrieve balls hit into the crowd?

I'm not sure this got answered amongst all the India-Pakistan chat over the last couple of pages, but simply the crowd through the ball back. Occasionally, or when the crowd is small this may take a few minutes while someone ferrets under a row of seats. When it's hit out of the ground, which can be quit common at smaller places like Taunton and Cardiff it's generally lost though I have seen a ball hit into the car park by Viv Richards brought back. I've also seen him, allegedly, reach the River Tone which is some hit.

So, when the ball is returned one of the umpires will inspect it for damage or if it is in a noticeably different condition to how it was previously. They inspect the ball after every over and the fall of the wicket, ostensibly to check for illegal tampering (picked seam, unnatural scuffs), so will always have a good idea to how it looks.

When a ball is lost or damaged the third umpire will bring a huge box of used balls of varying conditions and again the umpire, though the feidling captain and a couple of bowlers will often get involved, will choose the most similar. Often, and especially in Tests when the bowling team are toiling away, the ball is doing nothing and the batting team are piling on runs they'll attempt to get the ball changed, generally by claiming it's out of shape. Umpires have a little hoop amongst all the other gubbins they hav to lug about for this very purpose. The percieved wisdom being a different ball can bring different results.

Which can very occasionally lead to the spectacular batting collapse. The West Indies were victims of this in a Test at Auckland. Needing 290 to win and at 140 for 0 with Chris Gayle carting the ball around one hit landed on the roof and couldn't be retrieved. The lost ball was around 50 overs old, yet none of the replacement were of the required standard so the umpires took a 10 over old ball and artificailly aged it by rubbing it on concrete. What happened next was a ball that turned corners and the West Indies lost by 27 runs.

[Kevin S]

Anyway, this tournament's taking a dispiriting, and wholly predictable, turn - the top four look likely now to canter away from the others, giving a raft of meaningless matches in the last week or more of the group stage, probably when the weather's hot.

This, unfortunately, is where I am with it at the moment. The only slim hope is that the West Indies win all of their remaining matches to get to six, but even then I suspect we may get four teams with seven or more wins here.

The advantage of the system is that we will definitely have the best four sides in the semi finals but given South Africa's form I suspect we'd had got to these four with a snappier format too.

[Janik]

The detailed explanation/theory on Sky was thar Kohli's bat has taken a knock earlier in the innings that had left it making a clicking noise from the splice when it was swung in a certain manner. Evidently this is what Kohli heard and thought it was a noise of a nick on the ball.

They illustrated this with lots of shots of Kohli swishing the bat in the dressing room to recreate the sound and getting incredibly angry when it appeared to confirm the source of the noise. Dhoni then tried it himself for a while. It was quite a slapstick scene.

But this doesn't explain the lack of a signal on the technology. Snickometer/ultraedge etc. is just a fancy name for a sensitive microphone synced up to the pictures. If Kohli heard a clicking noise from his bat (from whatever source) why didn't ultraedge? If there was a noise and it wasn't detected, that raises more questions than answers. Like is it also deaf to nicks of the ball if they are too far away (wide/high) from where the microphone is located?

[Ray de Galles]

That's a good point, it may just be that Kohli's/Sky's theory was wrong of course.

[ursus arctos]

To illustrate Greenlander's informative post for Reed

[Janik]

Next we need to explain why Umpires wear Butchers coats...

[ursus arctos]

And why their baseball counterparts stopped wearing top hats

[Nocturnal Submission]

I've just seen the Windies scorecard. Gayle batted for 17 minutes, faced 13 balls and didn't score a run! Was he hungover or something?

[Satchmo Distel]

re. Viv, I remember watching a JPL game where it was announced that one of Viv's hits had reached the River Tone. John Woodcock wrote an article in 1994 for the Wisden Cricketers Almanack where he claimed it would happen when Viv and Botham were batting together and getting competitive.

If they'd had today's bats it would have been a cinch for them I'd think. They'd have been impossible to bowl to when on song.

[Hot Pepsi]

I had

I'm not sure this got answered amongst all the India-Pakistan chat over the last couple of pages, but simply the crowd through the ball back. Occasionally, or when the crowd is small this may take a few minutes while someone ferrets under a row of seats. When it's hit out of the ground, which can be quit common at smaller places like Taunton and Cardiff it's generally lost though I have seen a ball hit into the car park by Viv Richards brought back. I've also seen him, allegedly, reach the River Tone which is some hit.

So, when the ball is returned one of the umpires will inspect it for damage or if it is in a noticeably different condition to how it was previously. They inspect the ball after every over and the fall of the wicket, ostensibly to check for illegal tampering (picked seam, unnatural scuffs), so will always have a good idea to how it looks.

When a ball is lost or damaged the third umpire will bring a huge box of used balls of varying conditions and again the umpire, though the feidling captain and a couple of bowlers will often get involved, will choose the most similar. Often, and especially in Tests when the bowling team are toiling away, the ball is doing nothing and the batting team are piling on runs they'll attempt to get the ball changed, generally by claiming it's out of shape. Umpires have a little hoop amongst all the other gubbins they hav to lug about for this very purpose. The percieved wisdom being a different ball can bring different results.

Which can very occasionally lead to the spectacular batting collapse. The West Indies were victims of this in a Test at Auckland. Needing 290 to win and at 140 for 0 with Chris Gayle carting the ball around one hit landed on the roof and couldn't be retrieved. The lost ball was around 50 overs old, yet none of the replacement were of the required standard so the umpires took a 10 over old ball and artificailly aged it by rubbing it on concrete. What happened next was a ball that turned corners and the West Indies lost by 27 runs.

Thanks


It’s nice that the crowd knows it’s job and gets the ball back to the pitch.

I had heard about the box of balls in various conditions, but didn’t know about the rubbing on concrete.

[Ray de Galles]

Only one eye on WI v Bangladesh but looking a really good match. Mustafizur just got Hetmyer and Russel out in one over, 243-5 with 10 overs left.

[Satchmo Distel]

WI have scored 31 off 3 since Russell's departure to put them back in control.

Bangladesh are another team that I think has erred here by bowling first. Haven't they been paying attention to the chasing team stats?*

*Reverse hex, although I'd like WI to maintain their very slim chance of making the semis.

[Etienne]

Good game this, so far.

[Etienne]

I think the Taunton pitch is a batsmans pitch after the few overs (that's what Vic Marks said, anyway) and the Windies did struggle early on. So bowling first sensible. I think Bangladesh will be better prepared for a bouncer barrage if they know the scoring rate too. But I'd have them second favourites here.

[Levin]

I've just read in Wounded Tiger that in the 92 world cup (and also in the forthcoming 15 one) there were two new balls per innings, one for each end. Is that right?

[Ray de Galles]

Three wides, a six and a wicket in an eventful 9 ball final over (almost prep for The Hundred) leaves Bangladesh chasing 322.