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Tokyo Calling - Rugby 2019

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    Originally posted by Ray de Galles View Post

    Apart from football, what World Cup is for a sport that is played in most of the world?


    Track and field.

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      The thing is nobody is doing it down. Some people are commenting that the format is not ideal - which basically gets said about every competition in every sport.

      So yes there is a class thing that is part of the criticism of rugby union (as far as I can tell pretty much everywhere bar New Zealand and Wales) but it hasn't appeared here (in the thread about the WC) and in fact suggesting that there is some kind of unwarranted criticism seems like knee-jerk defensiveness

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        As always, it's the claims versus the reality. A tournament of rugby (or cricket etc) for people who follow the sport to enjoy - it usually delivers, as cricket's certainly did.

        The nonsense about making it a Global Thing is simply what suits have to say to justify their existence. They wouldn't get on the board if they didn't pretend it was going to sweep China and the USA, and produce a glossy plan. It won't, and it won't matter.

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          Originally posted by Ray de Galles View Post

          Apart from football, what World Cup is for a sport that is played in most of the world?

          If if we went by the old "more people play" canard then Angling would probably be the biggest other "sport" in the world - but nobody really cares about it do they?

          We seem to do this every RWC, find reasons to do down a competition that just keeps massively growing and growing. I never really know why.
          The reason this comes up every RWC is because every year a bunch of nations get spanked by ridiculous margins in a way that feels pointless so that the 8 of the same 10 nations can play each other in the quarter finals. The only drama is which one or two of the six nations won't make it (it'll be Italy and Scotland) and then you have the 3 antipodeans and Japan.

          And ok for almost all team sports you probably can't have a genuinely competitive world cup. But that doesn't mean we can't point out that adding more nations isn't improving the spectacle.

          When we have, e.g. a Russia v Japan semi final and a genuine chance of an outsider in the final then it won't be a discussion point any more.

          Anyway, safe travels. Enjoy Japan.

          Comment


            Originally posted by ad hoc View Post

            So yes there is a class thing that is part of the criticism of rugby union (as far as I can tell pretty much everywhere bar New Zealand and Wales)
            I feel the need to add the West Country/Gloucestershire here on behalf of Mrs Thistle who'd be annoyed if you told her Gloucester was "posh".

            (Gloucestershire is the only county I know where cheese is classed as sporting equipment.)

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              Originally posted by Janik View Post
              Cricket. Possibly basketball. According to this (Field) Hockey, but even as an advocate of that sport my response is you've added a nought (or two) by accident there. Hockey does have a wider geographical spread of competent national teams than very many sports, mind.
              Are you saying cricket is played by "most of the world"? That would seem an exaggeration when it's base of competitive countries is little wider than rugby's. Unless you're using the populations of the Asian sub-continent sides.



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                Originally posted by Sporting View Post

                Track and field.
                Athletics doesn't have a real World Cup, there was something called that last year but it was a hastily pulled together one-off event when there was little interest in a GB v USA challenge meeting and I don't think it will be repeated.

                Do you mean the World Championships?

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                  Is the Namibian team composed of Namibians, or are they South Africans who couldn't make the Boks?

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                    Ray, I read Janik's reference to cricket as going to number of participants and (perhaps) number of citizens of countries that play at a high level rather than number of countries per se. Basketball would also do well on that measure, given its growing popularity in China, the Philippines and Sub-Saharan Africa.

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                      Originally posted by Ray de Galles View Post
                      Are you saying cricket is played by "most of the world"? That would seem an exaggeration when it's base of competitive countries is little wider than rugby's. Unless you're using the populations of the Asian sub-continent sides.
                      I was using the ""more people play" canard"
                      And, as ursus speculates, I had China specifically in mind when mentioning Basketball
                      Last edited by Janik; 24-09-2019, 06:55.

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                        Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post

                        I feel the need to add the West Country/Gloucestershire here on behalf of Mrs Thistle who'd be annoyed if you told her Gloucester was "posh".

                        (Gloucestershire is the only county I know where cheese is classed as sporting equipment.)
                        And very proud of it we are to.

                        Gloucestershire is the only place I know where rugby is the working class sport. It is very much the main thing in the area and it's bred from a very early age. When I started secondary school in 1995 for PE we had two winter terms of rugby in Year 7 with no football at all. Then in the year 8 we started with yet another term of rugby before finally getting a go at football after Christmas 1996. The rugby team was God and, to be fair, we didn't have a bad team either. In the County cup we reached to semi-finals and a final, and the other comprehensives were also just as good. Pates and Sir Tommy Riches (the two grammar schools) often got roundly pasted by the likes of ourselves, Chosen Hill and Beaufort schools. St Peter's (the roman catholic academy school) were the best in the county by miles and often got to Twickenham to contest the national schools final - in fact when we reached the county cup final in year 10 we got hammered by St Peter's 45-0. I should have given us the lead in the first minute but dropped a pass when running into the corner. My teammates never forgave me that.

                        I remember seeing Al Murray as the Pub Landlord a few years ago in Cheltenham and one of his jokes was rugby was played in public school because posh people could afford more friends - he did a q and a bit at the end as a bit of improv and I asked if rugby was a posh sport why do they play it in Gloucester - "Any excused for a fight over that way I suppose". it got quite a laugh in fairness.

                        So yeah, rugby union is a posh sport everywhere but Gloucestershire.

                        Comment


                          Are the RU devotees down in Exeter posh?

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                            To reuse Zhou Enlai's response in a different context, it's too early to say. What sort of crowds were Exeter getting up to 15 years ago, ~1,000?

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                              It's only on pay TV in the Netherlands and Sweden.

                              Good job IRB, this is how you promote your showcase event in countries where the sport isn't played.

                              edit: And in the US:

                              US rugby fans will not be quite as lucky. NBC is offering every match of the Rugby World Cup for a set fee, where consumers can choose to pay either $200 for access to the entire tournament or $30 per match.
                              What a farce.

                              They make FIFA look good.
                              Last edited by anton pulisov; 24-09-2019, 08:24.

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                                Anyone watching Samoa-Russia? (I can't). It seems a bit lively.

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                                  Yes, it's low on quality but really enthralling. The yellow cards to the two Samoans could easily have been red, the second one almost certainly.

                                  Samoa have wriggled their way to a try, with Russia losing a man to a high tackle on the way. And as I type they bring it back to within a point with a drop goal.

                                  And Samoa through the middle with a try again.

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                                    Have we done predictions / are we doing predictions?

                                    Mine are:
                                    Quarter finalists
                                    Ireland, Japan, South Africa, New Zealand, England, France, Wales, Australia

                                    Semi finalists
                                    Ireland, New Zealand, England, Australia

                                    Finalists
                                    New Zealand, England

                                    Winners
                                    New Zealand

                                    Comment


                                      US rugby fans will not be quite as lucky. NBC is offering every match of the Rugby World Cup for a set fee, where consumers can choose to pay either $200 for access to the entire tournament or $30 per match.

                                      It's great stuff, this. NBC Sports Network shows some English rugby during the regular season; the newish Major League Rugby is doing OK. Rugby in the US is on a little upswing, particularly as so many people are utterly pissed off and bored with American Football. So what do you do if you're the IRB and NBC? Make sure that nobody can see most of the games.

                                      The organisers have - not unreasonably - scheduled matches for European, Antipodean and Japanese time zones rather than the west coast of the US, so it wouldn't be easy to watch matches live under any circumstances. But it's particularly hard to work up a head of excitement about this when almost all the matches are hidden from you.

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                                        Originally posted by Greenlander View Post
                                        Yes, it's low on quality but really enthralling. The yellow cards to the two Samoans could easily have been red, the second one almost certainly.

                                        Samoa have wriggled their way to a try, with Russia losing a man to a high tackle on the way. And as I type they bring it back to within a point with a drop goal.

                                        And Samoa through the middle with a try again.
                                        With you on almost all of that. A really scrappy, spikey game but very enjoyable even if it was low on quality. It was like watching some Llanelli v Bridgend SWALEC Cup clash from 1983, it all seemed very pre-professionalism.

                                        Apart from the quality of the stadium and size & quality of the crowd that is. Like Nagoya/Toyota, the whole place had really gone for it and turned out in force for the match. Apparently Kumagaya bills itself as "Rugby Town" and the very impressive stadium hosts Panasonic Wild Knights Top League games.

                                        Going back to to the game, Lee-Lo's hit was right in front of us and looked a red when viewed live and on every replay. Was less sure about the second one but Samoa were very lucky to not go down to 14, if not 13, men permanently. That said, I'm not sure Russia would have got the tries they needed to even then, given their lack of success with a one or two man advantage and even being repelled when they were hammering away for a consolation try.

                                        They didn't disgrace themselves though and I came away thinking Samoa have the most to do in order to meet the standards I'd expect from them.
                                        Last edited by Ray de Galles; 24-09-2019, 18:19.

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                                          Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
                                          US rugby fans will not be quite as lucky. NBC is offering every match of the Rugby World Cup for a set fee, where consumers can choose to pay either $200 for access to the entire tournament or $30 per match.

                                          It's great stuff, this. NBC Sports Network shows some English rugby during the regular season; the newish Major League Rugby is doing OK. Rugby in the US is on a little upswing, particularly as so many people are utterly pissed off and bored with American Football. So what do you do if you're the IRB and NBC? Make sure that nobody can see most of the games.

                                          The organisers have - not unreasonably - scheduled matches for European, Antipodean and Japanese time zones rather than the west coast of the US, so it wouldn't be easy to watch matches live under any circumstances. But it's particularly hard to work up a head of excitement about this when almost all the matches are hidden from you.
                                          Rugby on US TV is one instance where I really throw on my tinfoil hat and say "IT'S THE NFL!!!" Considering the drive for content, and the fact the US has had actually quite a large rugby-playing population for a while now, the drive to get rugby on US TV is very slow. It's getting better, but slow, and I wonder if the NFL wants the competition.

                                          Having said this, 26 games are supposed to be on NBCSN/NBC, which still makes it the best covered World Cup in the US in terms of live or same-day delay since 1995. But NBC are being real fucky with what games are actually on NBC/NBCSN. It seems their strategy is to give you very short notice as the next three games ARE on NBCSN (Fiji-Uruguay, Italy-Canada, England-USA - the USA games will all be on NBCSN) with no news beyond that.


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                                            I think Samoa will have learned a lot from that - second place is between them, Japan and Scotland. This is the group with most uncertainty, in my opinion.

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                                              NBC are also playing with the replays, which has meant that matches that were on NBCSN in the middle of the night have not been available at other times to subscribers who didn't pay the extortionate fees.

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                                                At one point I had been hoping to get to tomorrow's Fiji v Uruguay game but the distance from Tokyo to Kamaishi meant it wasn't really possible. The experience of the last two nights and this story about the host town have made me even more regretful I couldn't get there,

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                                                  Are you by yourself, or with other Welsh supporters?

                                                  I'm curious as to what first time visitors' impression of the country is

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                                                    And since you've now been to Kumagaya, this glimpse into its history may be of interest


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