German lyrics question

[Evariste Euler Gauss]

Watching a youtube footage of a Van Gaal speech at a Bayern victory celebration, to which Antonio Pulisao linked on p.12 of the Arsenal FA Cup thread, introduced me to the Bayern rock song "Stern des Suedens".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6aTUwNyRN0

It includes the lyric "ja so war es, und so ist es, und so wird es immer sein".

That has obvious echoes of the briefer "so war es und so wird es immer sein" which appears in Rammstein's typically grim and gruesome song "Rosenrot".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cz66xYVtST0

I assume FC Bayern weren't seeking to associate themselves with the dark and disturbing Berlin band, so I was wondering if the lyric echoes some well-known German poem or perhaps a common German proverb/saying. Any insights welcome. A Google search of that Rosenrot lyric seems to be entirely dominated by Rosenrot references.

[Stumpy Pepys]

German lyrics question

Looks like it goes back further than that, but you'll have to ask a native.



(Frau Wachholz appears to be a former East-German Schlager star … I can't tell you a great deal about West-German Schlager, let alone the former.)

[Wouter D]

German lyrics question

edit: no it's not...

[garcia]

German lyrics question

it strikes me that it's similar to a line in the mass - "...as it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end... - but i don't know how that's phrased in the german version. otherwise, i guess "so it was, and so it always will be" is a commonplace enough sort of sentiment, so possibly it's just a coincidence.

before the cup final the other day they played some awful bayern power ballad that wasn't "stern des suedens" - christ it was embarrassing - anyone any idea what it might have been called?

[treibeis]

German lyrics question

garcia wrote: before the cup final the other day they played some awful bayern power ballad that wasn't "stern des suedens" - christ it was embarrassing - anyone any idea what it might have been called?

I didn't watch the game, but I suspect it may have been FC Bayern, Forever Number One.

[Stumpy Pepys]

German lyrics question

treibeis wrote: I didn't watch the game, but I suspect it may have been FC Bayern, Forever Number One.

Before I clicked on that, I thought it was going to be the awful So Sehn Sieger Aus:

[treibeis]

German lyrics question

I thought it was going to be the awful So Sehn Sieger Aus:

I really hate that. I've been at under-9s games where the winning team, after having tonked the opposition 15-0 or whatever, do the ring-a-ring-of-roses dance and sing So sehen Sieger aus. I've even seen parents joining in.

[garcia]

German lyrics question

jesus christ, that's it. why is it in english?

(i mean "forever number one" is it - though i see the line is repeated in "so sehn..")

[ursus arctos]

German lyrics question

Why is "Football's Coming Home" (in English) a German terrace favourite?

I think the line is just a somewhat idiomatic phrase that has been used by songwriters in various contexts over the years.

As to the original question, the Bayern version is from 1998, whereas Rosenrot came out in 2005, so there is clearly no causal link there.

And to set garcia's Rosary-influenced mind at ease, this helpful translation site tells me that the German version of the language in the prayer is "es war im Anfang so auch jetzt und alle Zeit in Ewigkeit"

[treibeis]

German lyrics question

Why is "Football's Coming Home" (in English) a German terrace favourite?

I think it’s simply because it’s both sophisticated (you’re singing in Foreign) and easy to bellow along to.

There is the 'Fußball kommt nach Haus' translated cover version, but the bit where they repeat “kommt nach Haus” reminds people more of Heintje singing "Mama" than of a rip-roaring afternoon on the terraces.

[ursus arctos]

German lyrics question

It also plays into whatever aspect of the German soul it is that made the Kelly Family rich and gave the Hermes House Band multiple number ones.

[treibeis]

German lyrics question

ursus arctos wrote: It also plays into whatever aspect of the German soul it is that made the Kelly Family rich and gave the Hermes House Band multiple number ones.

With regard to music, the German soul is a complete mystery to me anyway. When I was new here, I once asked somebody why Schlager are so successful, even though the entire genre is based on just three different tunes and the ability to write words in an order such that you always rhyme “macht” with “Nacht” and “dich” with “mich”. His explanation was “You’re not German. You’ll never understand.”

And he was right. Not only do I not understand why it’s popular, I’, also clueless as to how they do it. I had to write some Schlager lyrics once (I’d lost a bet) and they were rubbish. Not just "rubbish" as in "a synonym for Schlager", but really, really crap; if I had a child who’d written lyrics as bad as mine were, I’d throw them out of the house.

I believe Tim Rice once said something along the lines of “If earning money writing bad musicals is as easy as everybody says, why doesn’t everybody do it?” He was right.

[Felicity, I guess so]

German lyrics question

re: football's coming home

I think it’s simply because it’s both sophisticated (you’re singing in Foreign) and easy to bellow along to.

Surely there was also an element of rubbing in who won the tournament, when German (National-Elf) fans 1st started singing it?

[Stumpy Pepys]

German lyrics question

Felicity, I guess so wrote: Surely there was also an element of rubbing in who won the tournament, when German (National-Elf) fans 1st started singing it?

I remember Juergen Klinsmann singing it on the balcony when they brought the trophy home, but were the German fans singing it prior to that?

[treibeis]

German lyrics question

Felicity, I guess so wrote: Surely there was also an element of rubbing in who won the tournament, when German (National-Elf) fans 1st started singing it?

You're almost definitely right about that. I remember the first time a German side played an English side after that, the German fans were singing it.

If you go and watch Peter And The Test Tube Babies in Germany, Peter still goes on about England's 5-1 victory over Germany in 2001. Half the crowd are too young to remember it, of course. Mind you, he also goes on about the 1966 World Cup, and he's barely old enough to remember that himself.