Who likes looking at charts?

[Satchmo Distel]

I am somewhat surprised that the White Album is the best-selling 1960s album by some margin, whereas it's Sergeant Pepper in the UK. Unless a double album counts as two sales?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

I am somewhat surprised that the White Album is the best-selling 1960s album by some margin, whereas it's Sergeant Pepper in the UK. Unless a double album counts as two sales?

Apparently so (wiki small print):

"Searchable Database of Gold and Platinum Awards". RIAA. Retrieved 2 April 2014. Note that the RIAA counts each record of a double album separately, meaning The Beatles is certified 24 times platinum, for 12 million units sold.

That would account for some of the other high flyers (particularly some of the greatest hits sets). It doesn't explain the runaway success of that Hootie and the Blowfish album though, as that was a single album,

The other caveat I was getting at is that they do certifications in batches, so e.g. the White Album went from 19x platinum (certified in 2001) to 24x in one go (certified in 2019).

[Auntie Beryl]

The above also accounts for The Wall featuring higher in the RIAA list than Dark Side Of The Moon - 23 certifications listed versus 12 - as The Wall is a double album, DSOTM has attracted more punters.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

May be of interest if only for the juxtaposition of the top two:

The Top 10 most-googled lyrics of 2020 in the UK :

1. Cardi B and Megan Thee Stallion - WAP
2. Dame Vera Lynn - We'll Meet Again
3. Eminem - Godzilla
4. Roddy Rich - The Box
5. James Thomson - Rule Britannia
6. Tones and I - Dance Monkey
7. Billie Eilish - No Time To Die
8. Matthew Wilder - Break My Stride
9. Arthur Christopher Benson - Land of Hope and Glory
10. Jawish 685 ft. Jason Derulo - Savage Love

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

And excuse the horrible formatting, but the Top 20 best selling UK Christmas No.1s

1 DO THEY KNOW IT'S CHRISTMAS? BAND AID 1984 - 3.82m
2 BOHEMIAN RHAPSODY QUEEN 1975/1991 - 2.62m
3 MULL OF KINTYRE/GIRLS' SCHOOL WINGS 1977 - 2.09m
4 MARY'S BOY CHILD/OH MY LORD BONEY M 1978 - 1.9m
5 I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND THE BEATLES 1963 - 1.82m
6 I WILL ALWAYS LOVE YOU WHITNEY HOUSTON 1992 - 1.66m
7 DON'T YOU WANT ME? HUMAN LEAGUE 1981
8 I FEEL FINE THE BEATLES 1964
9 WE CAN WORK IT OUT/DAY TRIPPER THE BEATLES 1965
10 HALLELUJAH ALEXANDRA BURKE 2008 - 1.33m
11 MERRY XMAS EVERYBODY SLADE 1973 - 1.32m
12 GREEN, GREEN GRASS OF HOME TOM JONES 1966
13 EARTH SONG MICHAEL JACKSON 1995
14 MARY'S BOY CHILD HARRY BELAFONTE 1957
15 DO THEY KNOW IT'S CHRISTMAS? BAND AID 20 2004
16 ANOTHER BRICK IN THE WALL (PART 2) PINK FLOYD 1979
17 2 BECOME 1 SPICE GIRLS 1996 - 1.15m
18 THAT'S MY GOAL SHAYNE WARD 2005
19 CAN WE FIX IT? BOB THE BUILDER 2000
20 WHEN WE COLLIDE MATT CARDLE 2010

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

And finally, with the same bad formatting, every UK Christmas No.2:

1952 YOU BELONG TO ME JO STAFFORD
1953 ANSWER ME DAVID WHITFIELD
1954 SANTO NATALE DAVID WHITFIELD
1955 ROCK AROUND THE CLOCK BILL HALEY AND HIS COMETS
1956 SINGING THE BLUES GUY MITCHELL
1957 MA HE'S MAKING EYES AT ME JOHNNY OTIS AND HIS ORCHESTRA WITH MARIE ADAMS
1958 HOOT MON LORD ROCKINGHAM'S XI
1959 WHAT DO YOU WANT ADAM FAITH
1960 IT'S NOW OR NEVER ELVIS PRESLEY
1961 TOWER OF STRENGTH FRANKIE VAUGHN
1962 THE NEXT TIME/BACHELOR BOY CLIFF RICHARD
1963 SHE LOVES YOU THE BEATLES
1964 DOWNTOWN PETULA CLARK
1965 WIND ME UP (LET ME GO) CLIFF RICHARD
1966 SUNSHINE SUPERMAN DONOVAN
1967 MAGICAL MYSTERY TOUR (EP) THE BATLES
1968 BUILD ME UP BUTTERCUP THE FOUNDATIONS
1969 RUBY, DON'T TAKE YOUR LOVE TO TOWN KENNY ROGERS AND THE FIRST EDITION
1970 WHEN I'M DEAD AND GONE MCGUINNESS FLINT
1971 JEEPSTER T. REX
1972 MY DING-A-LING CHUCK BERRY
1973 I LOVE YOU LOVE ME LOVE GARY GLITTER
1974 YOU AIN'T SEEN NOTHING YET BACHMAN-TURNER OVERDRIVE
1975 I BELIEVE IN FATHER CHRISTMAS GREG LAKE
1976 UNDER THE MOON OF LOVE SHOWADDYWADDY
1977 THE FLORAL DANCE BRIGHOUSE AND RASTRICK BRASS BAND
1978 Y.M.C.A. THE VILLAGE PEOPLE
1979 I HAVE A DREAM ABBA
1980 (JUST LIKE) STARTING OVER JOHN LENNON
1981 DADDY'S HOME CLIFF RICHARD
1982 BLUE CHRISTMAS (EP) SHAKIN' STEVENS
1983 MY OH MY SLADE
1984 LAST CHRISTMAS/EVERYTHING SHE WANTS WHAM
1985 SAVING ALL MY LOVE FOR YOU WHITNEY HOUSTON
1986 CARAVAN OF LOVE THE HOUSEMARTINS
1987 FAIRYTALE OF NEW YORK THE POGUES & KIRSTY MACCOLL
1988 ESPECIALLY FOR YOU KYLIE AND JASON
1989 LET'S PARTY JIVE BUNNY AND THE MASTERMIXERS
1990 ICE ICE BABY VANILLA ICE
1991 WHEN YOU TELL ME THAT YOU LOVE ME DIANA ROSS
1992 HEAL THE WORLD MICHAEL JACKSON
1993 BABE TAKE THAT
1994 ALL I WANT FOR CHRISTMAS IS YOU MARIAH CAREY
1995 WONDERWALL THE MIKE FLOWER POPS
1996 KNOCKIN' ON HEAVEN'S DOOR DUNBLANE
1997 TELETUBBIES SAY EH-OH! TELETUBBIES
1998 CHOCOLATE SALTY BALLS (P.S. I LOVE YOU) CHEF
1999 THE MILLENNUM PRAYER CLIFF RICHARD
2000 WHAT MAKES A MAN WESTLIFE
2001 HOW WONDERFUL YOU ARE GORDON HASKELL
2002 SACRED TRUST ONE TRUE VOICE
2003 CHRISTMAS TIME (DON'T LET THE BELLS END) THE DARKNESS
2004 FATHER AND SON RONAN KEATING FT. YUSUF ISLAM
2005 JCB SONG NIZLOPI
2006 PATIENCE TAKE THAT
2007 WHAT A WONDERFUL WORLD KATIE MELUA AND EVA CASSIDY
2008 HALLELUJAH JEFF BUCKLEY
2009 THE CLIMB JOE MCELDERRY
2010 WHAT'S MY NAME RIHANNA FT. DRAKE
2011 CANNONBALL LITTLE MIX
2012 IMPOSSIBLE JAMES ARTHUR
2013 HAPPY PHARRELL
2014 UPTOWN FUNK MARK RONSON FT. BRUNO MARS
2015 LOVE YOURSELF JUSTIN BIEBER
2016 HUMAN RAG'N'BONE MAN
2017 RIVER EMINEM FT. ED SHEERAN
2018 SWEET BUT PSYCHO AVA MAX
2019 OWN IT STORMZY FT ED SHEERAN & BURNA BOY

[Jah Womble]

There is a slight anomaly as regards 'the Christmas chart'. For example, in 1974, Wombling Merry Christmas climbed to #2 (dislodging BTO) on the chart issued on 24/12 (a Tuesday, obviously), so no longer features as the festive runner-up since that chart is officially dated '29/12/74' (ie, the week after).

Although clearly it should do. (Does this make sense? I hope it does.)

Some additional sales figures in bold:

1 DO THEY KNOW IT'S CHRISTMAS? BAND AID 1984 - 3.82m
2 BOHEMIAN RHAPSODY QUEEN 1975/1991 - 2.62m
3 MULL OF KINTYRE/GIRLS' SCHOOL WINGS 1977 - 2.09m
4 MARY'S BOY CHILD/OH MY LORD BONEY M 1978 - 1.9m
5 I WANT TO HOLD YOUR HAND THE BEATLES 1963 - 1.82m
6 I WILL ALWAYS LOVE YOU WHITNEY HOUSTON 1992 - 1.66m
7 DON'T YOU WANT ME? HUMAN LEAGUE 1981 - 1.637m
8 I FEEL FINE THE BEATLES 1964 - 1.423m
9 WE CAN WORK IT OUT/DAY TRIPPER THE BEATLES 1965 - 1.402m
10 HALLELUJAH ALEXANDRA BURKE 2008 - 1.33m
11 MERRY XMAS EVERYBODY SLADE 1973 - 1.32m
12 GREEN, GREEN GRASS OF HOME TOM JONES 1966 - 1.258m
13 EARTH SONG MICHAEL JACKSON 1995 - 1.210m
14 MARY'S BOY CHILD HARRY BELAFONTE 1957 - 1.188m
15 DO THEY KNOW IT'S CHRISTMAS? BAND AID 20 2004 - 1.184m
16 ANOTHER BRICK IN THE WALL (PART 2) PINK FLOYD 1979 - 1.146m
17 2 BECOME 1 SPICE GIRLS 1996 - 1.15m
18 THAT'S MY GOAL SHAYNE WARD 2005 - 1.112m
19 CAN WE FIX IT? BOB THE BUILDER 2000 - 1.029m
20 WHEN WE COLLIDE MATT CARDLE 2010 - 1.017m

I'm going by this list, which, as you can see throws up some different (probably updated) figures for one or two of the others.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...United_Kingdom

[3 Colours Red]

1961 TOWER OF STRENGTH FRANKIE VAUGHN

I take it not the same one as the one by The Mission?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

I take it not the same one as the one by The Mission?

Unfortunately not, but it does conjure up images of Frank Vaughan in a long black coat surrounded by dry ice and giving it the full lungs.

[Satchmo Distel]

Jah, that's a common issue with Xmas; any sales between the Xmas chart date and Xmas Eve inclusive will go on the post-Xmas chart. Thus in 1974 The Wombles' big sales on Dec 23 and 24 (a Monday and Tuesday) could not get them the No. 2 on a chart published on the 22nd. I think Lennon had the same issue in 1980 that cost him a No. 1 with his Xmas single because the post-Xmas chart just duplicated the Xmas one.

(btw I don't think the Radio 1 Tuesday chart included any sales after Saturday so it was really a couple of days out of date. I'm certain that Radio 1 on 24.12.74 would have played the chart with Bachman Turner Overdrive at 2, not The Wombles unless you have evidence showing otherwise).

Infact, as you suggest, I think this problem renders the Xmas No. 1 and No. 2 lists problematic by nature. You really need to merge two charts either side of Xmas Day to get a truer picture (but still not perfect).

Even worse is that, today, the technology exists to get true sales from Dec 18-24 but nobody publishes that chart except when Xmas Day is the 25th.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Even worse is that, today, the technology exists to get true sales from Dec 18-24 but nobody publishes that chart except when Xmas Day is the 25th.

You've lost me there - when is Xmas Day not the 25th?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Thus in 1974 The Wombles' big sales on Dec 23 and 24 (a Monday and Tuesday) could not get them the No. 2 on a chart published on the 22nd. I think Lennon had the same issue in 1980 that cost him a No. 1 with his Xmas single because the post-Xmas chart just duplicated the Xmas one.

(btw I don't think the Radio 1 Tuesday chart included any sales after Saturday so it was really a couple of days out of date. I'm certain that Radio 1 on 24.12.74 would have played the chart with Bachman Turner Overdrive at 2, not The Wombles unless you have evidence showing otherwise).

The OCC website shows it as:

Chart date 21.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 28.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 04.01.75 - No. 2
Chart date 11.01.75 - No. 25

...all on Saturdays so presumably the one dated 21st December was the one read out on Tuesday 24th, which was then repeated the following week and the 4th January one had sales from 23rd December to 4th January inclusive.

BTO fell from No. 2 to No. 6, but the dark horse in all of this is The Rubettes' Juke Box Jive which held its end up at No. 3 across both charts* and therefore could have claimed No. 2 on the hypothetical chart which ran from opening time on the 18th to closing time on the 24th.

*during a rollercoaster 23-8-4-3-8-3-3-3-10-12-32-38

[Satchmo Distel]

You've lost me there - when is Xmas Day not the 25th?

Sorry I meant when Friday falls on the 25th (charts are published on Fridays)

[Greenlander]

May be of interest if only for the juxtaposition of the top two:

The Top 10 most-googled lyrics of 2020 in the UK :

1. Cardi B and Megan Thee Stallion - WAP
2. Dame Vera Lynn - We'll Meet Again
3. Eminem - Godzilla
4. Roddy Rich - The Box
5. James Thomson - Rule Britannia
6. Tones and I - Dance Monkey
7. Billie Eilish - No Time To Die
8. Matthew Wilder - Break My Stride
9. Arthur Christopher Benson - Land of Hope and Glory
10. Jawish 685 ft. Jason Derulo - Savage Love

Number eight jumps out a bit. Why the sudden interest in an 80s one hit wonder?

[Satchmo Distel]

The OCC website shows it as:

Chart date 21.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 28.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 04.01.75 - No. 2
Chart date 11.01.75 - No. 25

...all on Saturdays so presumably the one dated 21st December was the one read out on Tuesday 24th, which was then repeated the following week and the 4th January one had sales from 23rd December to 4th January inclusive.

BTO fell from No. 2 to No. 6, but the dark horse in all of this is The Rubettes' Juke Box Jive which held its end up at No. 3 across both charts* and therefore could have claimed No. 2 on the hypothetical chart which ran from opening time on the 18th to closing time on the 24th.

*during a rollercoaster 23-8-4-3-8-3-3-3-10-12-32-38

That is my understanding too. It seems odd in retrospect that the Sunday Top 20 (as of 1974, only a Top 20 was played) was actually one compiled from sales that ended 8 days earlier but that was unavoidable because the technology simply did not exist then (unlike later) to get a chart ready by Sunday teatime from sales that ended the previous night.

[Satchmo Distel]

Number eight jumps out a bit. Why the sudden interest in an 80s one hit wonder?

Wiki explains:

The song gained more notoriety in 2020 on TikTok, as it was frequently used in TikTok videos - where users would text their friends the lyrics of the song. Matthew Wilder was thrilled at these memes, saying that the results are often bizarre but hilarious.[62] Afterwards, Wilder posted an official lyric video that featured text messages of the song's lyrics

Googling lyrics is like a modern equivalent of people buying sheet music, especially when you consider that Vera Lynn, back in the day, would mainly have been used to sell sheet music rather than records (which is why her all-time record sales are actually quite low - note also that there was a shortage in the war of shellac (which was used at that time to make bombs as well as records) which would have meant low sales).

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Number eight jumps out a bit. Why the sudden interest in an 80s one hit wonder?

It's 2020, so always safe to assume its TikTok related.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Or what Satch said

[Mumpo]

Jesus Jones had a bigger hit than this pre cut-off (Right Here Right Now)
[4] Jesus Jones - Real Real Real (1991/08/24) (20 wks)

Apologies if it's been mentioned in the interim but EMF of course hit #1 in 1990 with Unbelieveable

[Jah Womble]

Jah, that's a common issue with Xmas; any sales between the Xmas chart date and Xmas Eve inclusive will go on the post-Xmas chart. Thus in 1974 The Wombles' big sales on Dec 23 and 24 (a Monday and Tuesday) could not get them the No. 2 on a chart published on the 22nd. I think Lennon had the same issue in 1980 that cost him a No. 1 with his Xmas single because the post-Xmas chart just duplicated the Xmas one.

(btw I don't think the Radio 1 Tuesday chart included any sales after Saturday so it was really a couple of days out of date. I'm certain that Radio 1 on 24.12.74 would have played the chart with Bachman Turner Overdrive at 2, not The Wombles unless you have evidence showing otherwise).

Infact, as you suggest, I think this problem renders the Xmas No. 1 and No. 2 lists problematic by nature. You really need to merge two charts either side of Xmas Day to get a truer picture (but still not perfect).

Even worse is that, today, the technology exists to get true sales from Dec 18-24 but nobody publishes that chart except when Xmas Day is the 25th.

No, the chart revealed by Johnnie Walker on a Tuesday would've been the sales for the previous week (most likely up until the Saturday, yes), but on that occasion, he broke rank with his usual format and played the entire Top 30 (including the fallers) - and The Wombles rose from #5 to #2, Randy Bachman and his pals sliding down to #6.

I can't provide documented evidence of this, but I remember it very clearly - being a chart nerd, I listened to the entire show in my room with big sis, sharing a giant plate of sandwiches. (I also recall Walker playing the excellent Ire Feelings by Rupie Edwards [a former Top 10, but now falling at #18] and surprisingly saying it was the first time he'd ever played it. In retrospect, the record may well have received a daytime restriction on R1. But I digress.)

The OCC website shows it as:

Chart date 21.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 28.12.74 - No. 5
Chart date 04.01.75 - No. 2
Chart date 11.01.75 - No. 25

...all on Saturdays so presumably the one dated 21st December was the one read out on Tuesday 24th, which was then repeated the following week and the 4th January one had sales from 23rd December to 4th January inclusive.

BTO fell from No. 2 to No. 6, but the dark horse in all of this is The Rubettes' Juke Box Jive which held its end up at No. 3 across both charts* and therefore could have claimed No. 2 on the hypothetical chart which ran from opening time on the 18th to closing time on the 24th.

*during a rollercoaster 23-8-4-3-8-3-3-3-10-12-32-38

If requiring a 'broadcast' date, I think that for 1970s charts, the best bet is to rewind a few days from the weekend that's now recorded. There was usually a stagnant chart at the end of the year, but in the case of 1974, the Christmas charts were not published until the following week, which is why most resources will show The Wombles climbing to #2 on the first week of January - which clearly wouldn't have happened. Some might've bought it after the day itself, but nowhere near enough to hoist it in such a way. (Nor would it have held at #5 for two weeks ahead of Christmas, when demand was clearly higher.)

(NB It dropped back to #5 the following week, not #25 - which would've been a spectacular plunge.)

Yes, Juke Box Jive's chart life was indeed most odd. Almost enough to make one suspect 'computer error'.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

The 25 was my typo (lots of 2s and 5s going on there).

It is admirable the extent to which you are willing to batt on behalf of this record.

[Satchmo Distel]

Perhaps Walker was playing what today are called the "mids", a chart compiled up to the end of Monday? Radio 1 perhaps asked the chart company to compile data specifically for that Xmas Eve programme?

Rupie Edwards was at 14 on both Dec 22 and Dec 29, having been at 9 on Dec 15 (run: 38-20-10-9-14-14-18-29--33-46). Its exclusion from daytime radio 1 was clearly racist (IIRC Tony Blackburn was very hostile towards reggae). So the Walker chart you're recalling was not the Dec 22 or 29 one but most likely a specially compiled one (or the BBC's preferred chart even?)

[Jah Womble]

That's possible perhaps, but Johnnie W on a Tuesday lunchtime was at that time the standard slot for the new chart: I'd be on school hols since something like the 13th and can remember catching his show the week before with Mud climbing to the top (and BTO at #2). You'll have to take my word for this* - my mother was very grateful on the 24th because it got us out of the way for a couple of hours so that she could wrap presents in peace downstairs. (Edit: *You don't have to take my word at all, obviously..!)

The 25 was my typo (lots of 2s and 5s going on there).

It is admirable the extent to which you are willing to batt on behalf of this record.

Very good. Yes, I never thought I'd find myself arguing a case on behalf of my furry family from up the road, but there we are...

[Jah Womble]

Rupie Edwards was at 14 on both Dec 22 and Dec 29, having been at 9 on Dec 15 (run: 38-20-10-9-14-14-18-29--33-46). Its exclusion from daytime radio 1 was clearly racist (IIRC Tony Blackburn was very hostile towards reggae). So the Walker chart you're recalling was not the Dec 22 or 29 one but most likely a specially compiled one (or the BBC's preferred chart even?)

Well, this is where I'm saying there's an anomaly. Where Rupie Edwards was on the chart is pretty much down to the same debate: it fell to #18 in the chart that I absolutely heard Walker present on 24/12/74 - which may be an example of what you're suggesting, but I think far more likely that it simply wasn't published anywhere else until the week after. The logical movement of records during that pre-Christmas week tends to corroborate with my recollection - otherwise the suggestion is that The Wombles (#5 to #2), The Goodies (#13 to #7), Gilbert O'Sullivan (#18 to #12) and Showaddywaddy (#23 to 13) would all have had festive hits climbing the first week of January, which simply wouldn't have happened. So it's just a publishing delay that exists to this day in the record books.

Viz Ire Feelings itself, I think that the lack of airplay was down to both the 'racist' element you're describing and also owing to the fact that some R1 stuffed-shirts thought that there might be a sexual element to the lyric. Which I think there was.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

As mentioned for other reasons on the Chrimbo thread in World, this is the "first look" top 20 for the Christmas chart (which this year will be announced on Christmas Day itself):

(NEW) 1 DON'T STOP ME EATIN' - LADBABY
(9) 2 THIS CHRISTMAS - JESS GLYNNE
(1) 3 ALL I WANT FOR CHRISTMAS IS YOU - MARIAH CAREY
(2) 4 LAST CHRISTMAS - WHAM!
(59) 5 ALL YOU'RE DREAMING OF - LIAM GALLAGHER
(5) 6 FAIRYTALE OF NEW YORK - THE POGUES FT. KIRSTY MACCOLL
(21) 7 ROCKIN' AROUND THE CHRISTMAS TREE - JUSTIN BIEBER
(6) 8 MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE - SHAKIN' STEVENS
(7) 9 DO THEY KNOW IT'S CHRISTMAS - BAND AID
(11) 10 STEP INTO CHRISTMAS - ELTON JOHN
(13) 11 DRIVING HOME FOR CHRISTMAS - CHRIS REA
(16) 12 I WISH IT COULD BE CHRISTMAS EVERYDAY - WIZZARD
(12) 13 IT'S BEGINNING TO LOOK A LOT LIKE CHRISTMAS - MICHAEL BUBLE
(4) 14 POSITIONS - ARIANA GRANDE
(25) 15 MERRY XMAS EVERYBODY - SLADE
(17) 16 SANTA TELL ME - ARIANA GRANDE
(20) 17 UNDERNEATH THE TREE - KELLY CLARKSON
(8) 18 SWEET MELODY - LITTLE MIX
(NEW) 19 BORIS JOHNSON IS A F**KING C**T - K**TS
(4) 20 ONE MORE SLEEP - LEONA LEWIS

Usual horrible formatting from the OCC website, which I've only slightly improved.