New Music For 2019

[Sits]

Oh and the Bruce one is nicely mellow. He's starting to sound a bit like Tom Waits on the lower notes.

[imp]

There's so much wrongness here it's impossible even to begin stating the counter-case (or the counter-cake, arf). It would be like one of those legal affairs that drags on for decades when it's reported that the papers relating to it fill three warehouses. It's a biscuit that just happens to be called a 'cake'. It's a leap of the imagination. It's some marketing crook's idea of creativity from way back when. It does not mean literally that it's a fucking cake just because some twat at a biscuit company says so. Jesus.

[Jah Womble]

It's called a Jaffa Cake because it's a f***ing cake. It has a sponge base, ffs - biscuits are produced in a completely different way, as any idiot knows.

Whatever size or shape it might be, where it's kept in the supermarket or how it's consumed are all completely irrelevant.

Think otherwise if you must, but you're wrong.

[hobbes]

A bourbon cream isn't an American whiskey. Names are meaningless. Jaffa Cakes are biscuits.

[Jah Womble]

A bourbon cream is a biscuit. I'll give you that.

Otherwise, see my last sentence.

[Benjm]

Do bourbons and custard creams still exist? If I saw one on a plate I'd be worried there was some kind of Life On Mars timeslip happening. The biscuit aisle isn't a regular haunt of mine, admittedly.

[Jah Womble]

They do feel very 'having to go to nan's in the 1970s', it's true.

But they do apparently still exist. And what's more, Waitrose make their own:

https://www.waitrose.com/ecom/produc...002215-668-669

[WOM]

That was my favourite biscuit as a kid. Couldn't get enough of them. Then I ate a couple when I was really ill once and could never touch them again after that.

I still see them around, but Peek Frean isn't exactly the brand name on everyone's lips these days. "Your nan's biscuits" could be their tagline, for sure.

[elguapo4]

Do bourbons and custard creams still exist? If I saw one on a plate I'd be worried there was some kind of Life On Mars timeslip happening. The biscuit aisle isn't a regular haunt of mine, admittedly.

Bourbons and custard creams are the best you'll get with your cup of tea at meetings and training seminars in my job, tight bastards.

[Jah Womble]

"McVities defended its classification of Jaffa Cakes as cakes at a VAT tribunal in 1991, against the ruling that Jaffa cakes were 'biscuits' due to their size and shape and the fact that they were often eaten in place of biscuits.

The court found in favour of McVitie's and ruled that the product should be considered a cake, meaning that VAT is not paid on Jaffa Cakes in the United Kingdom."

McVitie's invented the blessed things in the 1920s, called them 'cakes' then, still refer to them as such now and even won a court case regarding the issue in the nineties - so they get to decide.

'Biscuits', my arse.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

I worked in a McVities factory around that time and this was a big deal, it had gone on for a few years. If they lost the case then Jaffa Cakes would have been 17.5% more expensive, at little financial benefit to the company (guess they would have been able to offset some VAT on the other side, but they certainly fought long enough so must have been worthwhile overall). IIRC one of the key tests was that a cake goes dry and hard when it ages, while a biscuit softens and falls to bits - and a Jaffa cake (or enough of it anyway) hardens.

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Oh and they very much still make bourbons and custard creams, both in the Carlisle factory. And when I was there (and presumably still now) the biscuits would come down the line and half would go into McVities wrapping and half into supermarket own brand. The only difference was on M&S branded stuff, because they were right fussy arses who insisted on higher standards than McVities themselves.

[Jah Womble]

I worked in a McVities factory around that time and this was a big deal, it had gone on for a few years. If they lost the case then Jaffa Cakes would have been 17.5% more expensive, at little financial benefit to the company (guess they would have been able to offset some VAT on the other side, but they certainly fought long enough so must have been worthwhile overall). IIRC one of the key tests was that a cake goes dry and hard when it ages, while a biscuit softens and falls to bits - and a Jaffa cake (or enough of it anyway) hardens.

So all these planks still referring to them as biscuits should wise up - it's thanks to their not being same that you're not paying stupid overheads.

The whole deal was briefly discussed on C4's The Last Leg yesterday night - the conclusion at which they arrived being the correct 'cake' one.

[KGR]

I'm sure you all remember Arthur & Martha's 2009 album 'Navigations', which featured the tremendous opening track 'Autovia'. Ahem.

Anyways, a remix album, 'Adjustments', came out last month. And Gabe Knox has remixed Autovia. I suspect many of you will enjoy this one.

[Simon G]

Oh and they very much still make bourbons and custard creams, both in the Carlisle factory. And when I was there (and presumably still now) the biscuits would come down the line and half would go into McVities wrapping and half into supermarket own brand. The only difference was on M&S branded stuff, because they were right fussy arses who insisted on higher standards than McVities themselves.

Isn't this also the case for other own brand products, such as baked beans and tinned spaghetti?

For the record I'm in the Jaffa Cakes as biscuits, purely because of how and when I eat them,

[Snake Plissken]

New Sleater-Kinney.

[Jah Womble]

I think that the single, Hurry On Home, is a much stronger cut, personally.

Looking forward to hearing the full album, anyways.

[johnr]

At the risk of derailing the thread, I once got sort-of blind-dated to a Sleater-Kinney gig in Brighton. Spent the entire gig thinking 'how do I get out of this?'. Any mention of them takes me right back there.

[Jah Womble]

Surely it's easy enough to 'lose' yourself in the crowd at a gig?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

Surely it's easy enough to 'lose' yourself in the crowd at a gig?

Particularly an Eminem gig.

[KGR]

808 State's first new track for 12 years has some nice acid-house touches.

[caja-dglh]

It would be a lot easier if they just decided to tax cake.

[imp]

Bloody hell, I somehow missed the entire biscuit/cake debate, allowing Jah Womble to peddle horrific lies virtually unchallenged, ignoring valid points from hobbes and Simon G. I mean, there‘s a pattern here. JW thinks we should penalise the tiniest encroachment on penalty kicks, and he thinks Jaffa Cakes should be called cakes just because some poncey fucking Eton-educated judge says so. I call him out for fear of authority and kowtowing to the establishment‘s rule-makers.

Some simple questions to clear this matter up once and for all. Anyone ever been to a birthday party where they stuck ten candles in a Jaffa Cake and invited 20 kids to divvy it up? Outside of Yorkshire, I mean. Ever seen a Jaffa Cake in a fucking cake shop? In a patisserie? Ever seen a recipe for Jaffa Cake in a baking book? Eh? EH?

[HeavyDracula]

The 808 State track is great.

and since when have we re-classified things because big business wanted to avoid tax?

[Jah Womble]

Bloody hell, I somehow missed the entire biscuit/cake debate, allowing Jah Womble to peddle horrific lies virtually unchallenged, ignoring valid points from hobbes and Simon G. I mean, there‘s a pattern here. JW thinks we should penalise the tiniest encroachment on penalty kicks, and he thinks Jaffa Cakes should be called cakes just because some poncey fucking Eton-educated judge says so. I call him out for fear of authority and kowtowing to the establishment‘s rule-makers.

Some simple questions to clear this matter up once and for all. Anyone ever been to a birthday party where they stuck ten candles in a Jaffa Cake and invited 20 kids to divvy it up? Outside of Yorkshire, I mean. Ever seen a Jaffa Cake in a fucking cake shop? In a patisserie? Ever seen a recipe for Jaffa Cake in a baking book? Eh? EH?

I think that you might be having some kind of breakdown.