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Kop on the left, then on the right: camera positions at Anfield

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    #26
    This is a stupendously interesting subject. Which grounds have changed TV gantry side the most? Villa Park seems to have switched from Main Stand to Doug Ellis Stand a fair few times. In fact, if someone had time, it'd be good to go through the entire 92 and tot up how many are on the Main Stand/dugout and tunnel side, and how many are on the opposite side? I for one would be absorbed.

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      #27
      Well, for reference, Burnley switched from the Bob Lord Stand to the Longside for the 1993-94 season. Changed back while the Longside was rebuilt but went back upon completion. Camera facing the dugout, tunnel to the right.
      Last edited by Snake Plissken; 15-08-2018, 16:02.

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        #28
        Love Street went from Main Stand paddock to gantry above North Bank, when said gantry was built in 1988/89 season.

        It can be pinpointed to sometime between 1st Oct 88 and 26th Nov 88
        https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NfIxkm62RlQ
        https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X8FGKXMcEJ0

        Off to see if I can find footage of the intervening Hearts or Rangers games

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          #29
          Didn’t White Hart Lane have a really vertiginous angle at one point, but then moved down significantly? I used to love that old ‘tactics cam’ type vantage point it had.

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            #30
            At Cheltenham, our camera is on the Colin Farmer stand looking across at the dugouts in front of the old Main Stand.

            Only once have I known a camera be put on the Main Stand side facing the Colin Farmer and that was for our FA Cup 4th Round tie against Newcastle which was live on BBC1. All other live games have just used the camera area in the Colin Farmer.

            Unfortunately I've only got the game recorded on VHS and there appears to be no links on Youtube.

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              #31
              Didn’t White Hart Lane have a really vertiginous angle at one point, but then moved down significantly? I used to love that old ‘tactics cam’ type vantage point it had.
              Yeah high up in the roof of the old Shelf side stand. It's a bit similar - in relative lower-league terms – at our gaff, with Brisbane Road's gantry being perched above the various offices and anciliary facilitites that make our West Stand seem so much larger than it is
              Last edited by E10 Rifle; 15-08-2018, 20:00.

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                #32
                Originally posted by E10 Rifle View Post
                Yeah high up in the roof of the old Shelf side stand. It's a bit similar - in relative lower-league terms – at our gaff, with Brisbane Road's guarantee being perched above the various offices and anciliary facilitites that make our West Stand seem so much larger than it is
                What kind of guarantee do you get at Brisbane Road, then?

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                  #33
                  I can answer a couple of the OP's questions regarding changes from the 1960s/70s, related to filming into the sun. Upton Park/Boleyn Ground & Leeds Road, Huddersfield both originally had their camera gantries opposite where they later spent most of their time. Upton Park originally had its camera position in the West Stand (you can see this from footage of West Ham v. Chelsea from August 1966, the first match after the 1966 World Cup Final), but in 1968 they opened the new East Stand or Chicken Run & put the gantry in there because the sun didn't shine as directly into it as it did in the West Stand.

                  At Leeds Road, the camera used to be opposite the Main Stand above a big standing terrace but later switched to the Main Stand, again you can see this from footage of Huddersfield v. Arsenal from early 1971, where it's still opposite the Main Stand.

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                    #34
                    I remember really enjoying the overhead wire shots the first time I noticed them being used in a big tournament (Euro 2012?), thinking that it remedies a lot of what you miss watching on television in terms of the shape of the game. I'm a big fan. Give me that* and an option to turn off the commentary, and I might even consider actually paying money to watch football on television.


                    * edit: I appreciate that this would probably be unmanageable at the vast majority of grounds, allow a man his dreams.

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                      #35
                      My god, what a first post.

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                        #36
                        I'm about to leave the house, which is annoying as now I am thinking about when the gantry was introduced, all of the earliest football footage of course being filmed from the touchline, or behind one of the goals, as per this footage of Liverpool vs. Everton in 1902. It's remarkable on all the Mitchell and Kenyon (etc.) clips, how little of anything you can make out. I presume that, aside from different expectations, people had a different way of watching.

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                          #37
                          Concurring with everyone else, welcome Sporting, and an excellent starter for 10 (thousand, with that sort of question).

                          I think Celtic have, but have tweeted Celtic to find out for certain, as Google knows nowt about this.

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                            #38
                            I have a long-standing conspiracy theory: when grounds get expanded / redeveloped, the cameras are located in a position that gives minimal "screen time" to away supporters. They seem well hidden at Newcastle and Man Utd, for example.

                            Like all conspiracy theories, evidence to contradict this is not needed. But further examples of its truth will be welcome.

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                              #39
                              The away supporters are well hidden at Newcastle. Top tier off in one corner.

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                                #40
                                Just like Barcelona and Real Madrid

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                                  #41
                                  Carrow Road looks weirdly the same as in a video of a match against Everton in 1972, with the camera facing the tunnel, despite all four sides having been rebuilt since then. City in green socks, strangely.
                                  Last edited by Kevin S; 15-08-2018, 23:20.

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                                    #42
                                    Originally posted by Kevin S View Post
                                    Carrow Road looks weirdly the same as in a video of a match against Everton in 1972, with the camera facing the tunnel, despite all four sides having been rebuilt since then. City in green socks, strangely.
                                    Is there a video you're referring to here Kev?

                                    The green socks seem to have been by no means unique in club history, according to Historical Football Kits – see also 1910-11, 1919-20 and 1936-38 (back when they were a change from black socks), or more pertinently 1946-47, 1950-52 and 1954-57. 1972-73 appears to have been the last time they were anything but yellow, though.

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                                      #43
                                      Yes, this one:
                                      https://youtu.be/yWuAJn0KJdY

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                                        #44
                                        Originally posted by tee rex View Post
                                        I have a long-standing conspiracy theory: when grounds get expanded / redeveloped, the cameras are located in a position that gives minimal "screen time" to away supporters. They seem well hidden at Newcastle and Man Utd, for example.

                                        Like all conspiracy theories, evidence to contradict this is not needed. But further examples of its truth will be welcome.
                                        Well, the league introduced a ruling to make away fans more visible for which Newcastle got an exemption on the grounds that the proposed pitchside location would make confrontation and conflict more likely on peoples' way in and out of the stadium. Sounds like nonsense to me, like, though I don't think I've seen around the back of the Leazes End since they built it to its present size.

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                                          #45
                                          It's an interesting theory. From memory, in the Premier League alone you have the following teams with away fans completely out of view (not visible from main camera at all):

                                          Bournemouth
                                          Cardiff
                                          Crystal Palace
                                          Everton
                                          Manchester United
                                          Newcastle
                                          West Ham

                                          Chelsea and Liverpool have away fans placed in the bottom left corner and only just about visible at times.

                                          Wolves place away fans directly opposite the main camera angle, and all the others simply have away fans behind the goal in clear view.

                                          I don't know where away fans will be in Spurs new stadium in relation to the main camera.

                                          More than happy to be corrected on these by the way.

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                                            #46
                                            Norwich put the away fans on one edge of the stand from which the camera shoots so you don't often see them, unless their manager them to fuck off when they score or something. They did, I think, briefly have one tier of an end but there was a lot of mither as a result any they were moved back to the south stand. The way to resolve it would be to replace the tiny City stand and put the camera that side. Which would reverse the angle after 50-odd years.

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                                              #47
                                              Tangentially to the subject of where away fans are located, I seem to remember that there used to be a couple of clubs whose main singing/chanting supporters were not in the traditional behind the goal zone, but alongside the long edge of the pitch. I think Man City at Maine Road were one of these clubs, and maybe Burnley as well, though I'm much less sure on this one.

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                                                #48
                                                Originally posted by ursus arctos View Post
                                                Just like Barcelona and Real Madrid
                                                Where away fans, as in most of Spain, are relatively rare in any case.

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                                                  #49
                                                  Originally posted by Sporting View Post
                                                  Tangentially to the subject of where away fans are located, I seem to remember that there used to be a couple of clubs whose main singing/chanting supporters were not in the traditional behind the goal zone, but alongside the long edge of the pitch. I think Man City at Maine Road were one of these clubs, and maybe Burnley as well, though I'm much less sure on this one.
                                                  Nope, you are correct. The Longside was the main chanting area until its demolition, and the home fans took up just over half of the long edge of the pitch. Then a small no mans land, then the away support.

                                                  With the rebuilding of the Longside into the seated James Hargreaves Stand, away fans were given the Cricket Field Stand as - with typical lack of foresight and costcutting - the JH and Jimmy McIlroy stands were not built with possible segregation in mind. This meant that the away fans were housed in the loudest stand on top of their own teams dressing room. A couple of years ago, the club finally decided to split the CFS and allow home fans back in there. There is a temporary no mans land separating the two sets of supporters, but that can be moved as requirements dictate. (Leading to this great photo from the other week.)

                                                  https://twitter.com/clivelawrence1/status/1025152115440865280

                                                  The CFS has become the main singing area now. There used to be a singing block in the JH Lower, but it attracted too many Coke bottle throwing twats and people got sick of them.

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                                                    #50
                                                    Who the hell cares whether away fans are visible from the main camera gantry?

                                                    Kev S, I remember seeing some footage on youtube of a norwich game from circa 1970, and the camera gantry was behind the goal (open end) in the corner.

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