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Leicester than zero? - Premier League 2018/19

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    RAWK definitely wants closing down.

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      The only meaningful difference between man utd fans and liverpool fans is that it's 6 seasons since man utd won the league, but there's no-one under 37 with a meaningful memory of liverpool winning the league, so they're that little bit crazier and more desperate, but you can see the same curdled entitlement.

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        I think we can all accept that 2018 football is at the peak of historic football intensity and sophistication. Does that really mean that Liverpool 2018 are "better" than Liverpool 1988 or Liverpool 1981 though? I reckon a hyper-fit midtable 2018 Championship side would simply overrun Puskas's Hungary in the their prime. Does that mean that Bristol City 2018 > Hungary 1954?

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          Not if a person just 'reckons' it, no.

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            Originally posted by seand View Post
            I think we can all accept that 2018 football is at the peak of historic football intensity and sophistication.
            There's a few Ipswich fans who might have something to say about that.

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              Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
              Watching the footage of the two of them at the end, Klopp spoke into Silva's ear and if you know what I mean it looked like he was apologising. I'm not sure what else he would have been saying. If I'd just seen my keeper do that then it would have gone in ear and out the other for me so a misunderstanding seems likely.

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                I think we can all accept that 2018 football is at the peak of historic football intensity and sophistication. Does that really mean that Liverpool 2018 are "better" than Liverpool 1988 or Liverpool 1981 though? I reckon a hyper-fit midtable 2018 Championship side would simply overrun Puskas's Hungary in the their prime. Does that mean that Bristol City 2018 > Hungary 1954?

                It's not just that they're fitter, they're also massively more skillful. tactically aware, technically consistent and more capable of operating collectively at speeds that people back in the 50's would have thought of as wizardry. Football has moved on a massive amount in the last five years, puskas et al were better than everyone else 65 years ago. A non league team now would hammer the 1954 hungarian team at their peak. a lot of football just hadn't been invented in 1954.

                Those teams of the past were better than the teams around them, and if they were really good or influential they helped move things forward, often in great big leaps. But thinking that things from the past were better than they are now, just generally means that you're getting old.
                Last edited by The Awesome Berbaslug!!!; 04-12-2018, 12:02.

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                  "A non league team now would hammer the 1954 Hungarian team at their peak. a lot of football just hadn't been invented in 1954."

                  I don't get that. How would they get the ball off the Hungarians? The latter were also far less protected by refs and could dish out some physical stuff (Battle of Berne).

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                    Like the old Harry Enfield sketch in which the Current Liverpool team run rings round the Arsenal of the 1930s until Arsenal start kicking shit out of them..

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                      I'd like to see how the non-league side copes with 1950s kit, boots and footballs.

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                        Excellent point. You simply could not play the modern game with those kits, boots and footballs, nor on pitches of that era. To be fair to Puskas, you have to imagine him under a current fitness coach wearing current equipment and playing with a current ball. Ditto Di Stefano, Finney, Matthews, Charlton, Best, Eusebio, Duncan Edwards.

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                          I can't imagine Puskas with any fitness coach, 2018 or 1950s.

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                            The game is the same in name only - saying 'such-and-such a team would run rings around Hungary of 1954' with any degree of certainty is plainly ridiculous. I mean, which set of rules would apply? What kind of kit/paraphernalia?

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                              The point is that Hungary were a very innovative team, who were able to stuff england because they had made a great tactical leap forward, and england just didn't have the first idea how to deal with it. The flip side of that is that no-one is surprised at the idea of a deep lying centre forward any more. there have been 65 years of tactical and technical advances that mean that players even down to a very low level of football think about football in a completely different way. There was a massive tactical innovation by Brazil in 1958 which makes them look an awful lot more recognizable to modern viewers, (involving wingers who tracked back, and full backs who attacked) and they also were rather innovative by showing to the world that the two best players in the world in every respect were black, so perhaps people needed to reexamine some of their attitudes over the next 40 years.

                              It should be taken for granted that as sports progress, they become radically different. There is something that is a bit odd about football, and that is people seem to underestimate just how quickly and how much the sport is changing. It's not helped by the way it is covered. This is really obvious in Ireland, where it's just one of four team sports. All four sports have undergone massive transformations in terms of physical preparation, technical improvement, and tactical development, leading to spiraling standards, and a situation where recently retired stars will cheerfully admit that they wouldn't be able to cut it. The most recently retired are the ones who have the highest regard for the pace of change, with older pundits looking increasingly nervous that they can't really follow what is going on.

                              Football has palpably gone through the same sort of revolution, but instead it has pundits who are either gambling addicts who are desperate to maintain their connection to the game today by offering analysis that is pure brexit, and pretending that the game hasn't changed and they're still relevant. (I'm thinking of you in particular Kevin Kilbane) people spend all their time talking about passion as though it was the fifties, and eschewing obvious evidence of organization, in favour of showing clips of individual events divorced of context. The weird thing is that we wind up underselling just how good modern footballers are. and missing out what what managers are achieving, and basically generally failing to understand what is going on. I mean the idea that you'd have something like this mick mcCarthy fiasco in any other irish sport is unthinkable. Appointing a manager you had 20 years ago as if nothing had changed? Football is so focused on the relative strength of teams that no-one notices how everything has improved so much in absolute terms.

                              One thing I find amusing is the tension between how footballers have to construe the world as professional footballers and their awareness of what goes into being a top level footballer, and then being shouted at by angry people for not showing enough passion or testicles if they don't win. I think you could see that leak out in these comments from kolorov at the weekend. "The fans have a right to be annoyed and we respect that, but they must be conscious of the fact that they know nothing about football."

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                                Watford have pulled it back to 2-1 against Man City. It seems as though Fernandinho is wearing a rainbow armband. Man city have some balls on them.

                                Brighton won 3-1 against palace despite Shane duffy getting a red card, for doing that head push thing. I can only imagine that contact with duffy's huge easter island head is deeply unpleasant.
                                Last edited by The Awesome Berbaslug!!!; 04-12-2018, 21:45.

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                                  Come on Watford, you useless bastards.

                                  I still can't stand Troy Deeney, like.

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                                    Eyeroll.

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                                      Do you think Klopp thought his little jog was worth eight grand?

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                                        yes. It has made him a kop legend. They'll be singing songs about it, and sharing memes about it in 50 years time.

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                                          I doubt that's all that much to him.

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                                            You’re funny, Tobes

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                                              Originally posted by Toby Gymshorts View Post
                                              I doubt that's all that much to him.
                                              personally no, professionally yes. He completely understands the showbiz bollocks side to being a highly paid modern football manager.

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                                                Well, yes. He's done the appearing contrite thing, he's not contested the fine, and he's given all the correct soundbites. He's not an idiot, despite his trying his best to appear one.

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                                                  Yes, I'm as fickle as the next person who might have once called themselves a fan but is now trying to detach themself from this toxic bullshit.

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                                                    That feels like it should be hyphenated.

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