Jason Lee

[Nefertiti2]

responds to Baddiel's apology (and talks about how it felt to be the brunt of his racist bullying) here

[Nefertiti2]

Thread here

https://twitter.com/AbsoluteLeePod/status/1594637555173298176?s=20&t=pNCqlJgcDzhg7TS4MD0aMw

[Nefertiti2]

Baddiel not long ago

https://twitter.com/MashStPaddy/status/1594659252693508096?s=20&t=pNCqlJgcDzhg7TS4MD0aMw

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Gotta say this would really mean so much more if he wasn't making a fucking television programme about it. Someone making a tv programme about their personal growth really needs to work on their crippling narcissism.

[Nefertiti2]

this is also revealing of the man

https://twitter.com/Arthurcurrie199/status/1594661103715467267?s=20&t=uzms5_6k5YNft2dy2rj40Q

[Nefertiti2]

Gotta say this would really mean so much more if he wasn't making a fucking television programme about it. Someone making a tv programme about their personal growth really needs to work on their crippling narcissism.

the real victim

https://twitter.com/RivkahBrown/status/1594812617528418304?s=20&t=uzms5_6k5YNft2dy2rj40Q

[Tony C]

Gotta say this would really mean so much more if he wasn't making a fucking television programme about it. Someone making a tv programme about their personal growth really needs to work on their crippling narcissism.

100%

[Satchmo Distel]

Modern comedians are supposed to have some self-awareness. Baddiel is more like Hillary Clinton - "why do they hate me so when I apologized for calling black men predators?"

[ad hoc]

Is this thread about Jason Lee or David Baddiel? I have the feeling it would say something (though I'm not sure entirely what), if a thread about a victim of racism became about the bully who victimised him in the first place.

Having said that however, I will continue with the direction of the thread...

https://twitter.com/Jacob_Judah/status/1594822104041627662

[DCI Harry Batt]

It's a fair shout, ad hoc. I'd like to know some more about Jason Lee.

[Cousin Boneless]

I do remember playing Forest at Highfield Road in 1995 and singing the pineapple head song. I was too young to understand it all and only watched the Euro 2004 reboot of fantasy football. I would image that the original series hasn't aged well.

[Tony C]

“He claimed to not be aware of criticism from within the Jewish community over his theses. “Literally no one” he said had come to him with any concerns, he said”

Apart from the two Jewish writers quoted in the piece, presumably.

[EIM]

I listened to the podcast last night while doing the washing up. I liked Jason Lee a lot. His questions were relevant, probing, very personal, and made Baddiel - who I didn't like, or even believe - squirm. Lee certainly made me think about past behaviour of mine, not racism but bullying, and how what I think of as affectionate ribbing could actually be felt by the victim.

[Satchmo Distel]

Baddiel is like a white Yorkshire cricketer who thought using the P-word was just bantz, and although he now realizes it was wrong, the victim should accept his apology and let him continue to coach other Asian players, and even occupy the moral high ground on racism against others.

[ooh aah]

With the whole perpetrator as victim thing going on here, I swear Baddiel must be related to Luis Suarez.

[RobW]

Listening to it now. Very good. I remember the sketches on FF and other sketches that i'm sure Baddiel would be ashamed of. Statto calling Baddiel the Y-word, and then the audience chanting it at him, springs to mind. As Lee says, how did some of this stuff get allowed to be broadcast? Barmy to think of it now. Never seen that Leigh Francis sketch, nor when it was created. Presumably almost a decade after Fantasy Football aired?

Have a lot of time for Jason Lee, as a former Lincoln player. As he says, he had a good career. Unfortunately, I think my only memory of him playing for City was getting sent off, but did see him come on for Forest against Bayern Munich a few years later in the UEFA Cup. Thrilled to see a former Imp on the same pitch as Papin and Klinsmann.

[Flynnie]

“He claimed to not be aware of criticism from within the Jewish community over his theses. “Literally no one” he said had come to him with any concerns, he said”

Apart from the two Jewish writers quoted in the piece, presumably.

I mean, one of the subtexts of this whole kerfuffle is left-wing Jews (even or especially when they're practicing in some way) being basically gaslighted by the Baddiels and Finkelsteins of the world that their criticism or defence doesn't matter.

[Sean of the Shed]

Have a lot of time for Jason Lee, as a former Lincoln player. As he says, he had a good career. Unfortunately, I think my only memory of him playing for City was getting sent off, but did see him come on for Forest against Bayern Munich a few years later in the UEFA Cup. Thrilled to see a former Imp on the same pitch as Papin and Klinsmann.

I also remember him at Lincoln. He was one of those players who one game had you thinking how he ever became a professional footballer then the next one giving the opposition defence nightmares. He obviously had enough about for both Southend and then Forest to pay (what was at the time) a decent fee for him.
I also got to see him a few times at the tail end of his career whenever Tamworth played Boston, and he usually stood out at that level. Even then you'd still hear the odd comments about the pineapple, long after he had shaved his head.

[Nesta]

Just from a football perspective, he always seemed a strange target. Like, "oh, he's doing Jason Lee of Forest... is he in bad form or something? I guess he must be as that's what the jokes are about". I daresay Forest fans were frustrated that he wasn't as good as peak Stan Collymore, but it wasn't like Jason Lee having a dry spell was the talk of the playgrounds and pubs or anything before that sketch. No more so than, say, Kevin Gallen or Savo Milosevic, who for some reason they chose not to single out.

[imp]

Listening to it now. Very good. I remember the sketches on FF and other sketches that i'm sure Baddiel would be ashamed of. Statto calling Baddiel the Y-word, and then the audience chanting it at him, springs to mind. As Lee says, how did some of this stuff get allowed to be broadcast? Barmy to think of it now. Never seen that Leigh Francis sketch, nor when it was created. Presumably almost a decade after Fantasy Football aired?

Have a lot of time for Jason Lee, as a former Lincoln player. As he says, he had a good career. Unfortunately, I think my only memory of him playing for City was getting sent off, but did see him come on for Forest against Bayern Munich a few years later in the UEFA Cup. Thrilled to see a former Imp on the same pitch as Papin and Klinsmann.

I remember watching that match on TV in Switzerland and getting very excited that Jason Lee was somehow on the same pitch as Lothar Matthaeus. He was good at Lincoln the few times I saw him. I also remember watching Baddiel-Skinner a few times and thinking how shambolic and laddish it all was, and ‚we‘re so clever for being ironic about footie‘. Must check out the podcast.

[imp]

I listened to the podcast last night while doing the washing up. I liked Jason Lee a lot. His questions were relevant, probing, very personal, and made Baddiel - who I didn't like, or even believe - squirm. Lee certainly made me think about past behaviour of mine, not racism but bullying, and how what I think of as affectionate ribbing could actually be felt by the victim.

I was at a funeral in my home town earlier this year. There were teachers and kids from my school I haven‘t seen in 35 years or so. I spent half of the reception apologising.

[Erskine Bridges]

As I recall it, part of the ‘joke’ was that Jason Lee hadn’t scored for a while. I thought it was cruel at the time and racist but it couldn’t be racist or it wouldn’t have been broadcast, would it? And it certainly wasn’t funny. I hadn’t heard the term ‘punching down’ back in the nineties but I could recognise it.

I’m maybe misremembering but I don’t recall much of that.

However, I did like Fantasy Football, although always thought Frank Skinner was the funny one. Baddiel was less a straight man than a whiny often unfunny fuck. But it was a prime time TV comedy show devoted to football, which was quite rare.

Has Frank Skinner apologised?

[Hot Orange]

I’m not sure. In an interview in the Guardian the other day, he said “It makes me ashamed. We fucked up. I certainly don’t want to defend it in any way.”

[Patrick Thistle]

I’m not sure. In an interview in the Guardian the other day, he said “It makes me ashamed. We fucked up. I certainly don’t want to defend it in any way.”

That sounds a lot like genuine contrition to me.

[San Bernardhinault]

Weirdly, I don't recall thinking it was racist - not that I watched much Fantasy Football so maybe I didn't see the blacking up, more likely I was just young and ignorant and didn't know how racist it was.

But I do remember that, even at the time, it made me very uncomfortable. All that picking on one person. I think I recognised it as bullying, even though I probably wouldn't have put that word to it.