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    Winding up orders

    According to this Bolton, Macclesfield and Ebbsfleet are all facing winding up orders in court tomorrow. https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/co...ies-winding-up The Bolton situation is pretty desperate but are we in danger of loosing any of the three?


    #2
    I know this won't win me any friends for saying this, but a lot of football clubs deserve to go out of business. I had always assumed that football clubs debts were to other clubs for transfer fees etc. Yet when you look underneath it, they owe the St Johns Ambulance, bakeries, butchers, local suppliers. My own club Southend still owe a local theatre (Cliff's Pavilion) around 30k for a Christmas party held there ten years ago. But of course football clubs never go bust do they, there's always someone to rescue a club, buy it out of administration, live the dream etc. I just wonder if the costs are getting so enormous these benefactors are going to start to run out.

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      #3
      The Bolton verdict likely to be broken first by this chap:
      https://twitter.com/SuperWhiteSmurf

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        #4
        As someone has put it, barrister Hilary Stonefrost is the best defender Bolton have ever had. They've been granted two more weeks to get 300k they owe Macron.

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          #5
          Originally posted by Paul S View Post
          I know this won't win me any friends for saying this, but a lot of football clubs deserve to go out of business. I had always assumed that football clubs debts were to other clubs for transfer fees etc. Yet when you look underneath it, they owe the St Johns Ambulance, bakeries, butchers, local suppliers. My own club Southend still owe a local theatre (Cliff's Pavilion) around 30k for a Christmas party held there ten years ago. But of course football clubs never go bust do they, there's always someone to rescue a club, buy it out of administration, live the dream etc. I just wonder if the costs are getting so enormous these benefactors are going to start to run out.
          They do go out of business. Rangers did relatively recently, for example. And Middlesborough before them. But it's only the legal entity that will ever go. The clubs continue, as the number of people who care for them as institutions means a phoenix club will pretty well always arise immediately if that happens.

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            #6
            All three survive today. It all seems a bit desperate though, all three have been late paying employees this season and they've only paid their VAT bills this morning.

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              #7
              Originally posted by Janik View Post
              They do go out of business. Rangers did relatively recently, for example. And Middlesborough before them. But it's only the legal entity that will ever go. The clubs continue, as the number of people who care for them as institutions means a phoenix club will pretty well always arise immediately if that happens.
              I know you were not implying anything here, but seeing as we're being lumped in with Rangers I will point out that Middlesbrough Football & Athletic Company (1986) Ltd paid the previous entity's debts in full and therefore has a somewhat stronger claim to be a continuation of the same club. No one is taking that 1976 Anglo-Scottish cup from us!

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                #8
                Phoenix clubs having getting a rough deal of late by having to start from well down the pyramid (Darlington, Hereford). Where would these three have to start from?

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                  Phoenix clubs having getting a rough deal of late by having to start from well down the pyramid (Darlington, Hereford). Where would these three have to start from?
                  Hereford certainly weren't harshly treated. They folded in Step 3 and were allowed to reform in Step 5. They were back at Step 3 in two seasons. Darlington were treated a little more harshly particularly as they didn't actually fold, but the FA refused to sanction the transfer of the golden share because they left administration without agreeing a CVA. But their real problem was the lack of a Step 3+ ground to play which is what led to them being placed at Step 5.

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                    #10
                    I'm quite sure Hereford started in Step 6 (the Midland League - same level as Hellenic League) - they were playing the likes of Westfields and Old Wulfrunians for a season before promotion to the Southern League South and West Division, and then promotion to the Southern Prem.

                    Worcester City (also Conference North when they resigned) are now in the Midland League which surprised me.

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                      #11
                      Hereford started in the top division of the Midland League, which is step 5.

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                        #12
                        Midland League is actually four tiers

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by Simon G View Post
                          Worcester City (also Conference North when they resigned) are now in the Midland League which surprised me.
                          Im pretty sure Worcester took voluntary relegation.

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                            #14
                            AS a general rule of thumb, a reformation of a club that has become insolvent should start at least 2 tiers lower than the club was previously at, but it was always a complete lottery, as the FA simply had no rules in place to properly manage it.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by Grimmer View Post

                              Im pretty sure Worcester took voluntary relegation.
                              That's what I meant by them resigning their position, but I take your point.

                              It would be interesting to read up fully on what's gone on at Worcester - sold their ground to developers with no real plans, now playing in Bromsgrove (I think) having had a few seasons elsewhere, and playing 3 divisions lower than where they were when they sold the ground.

                              I went to St George's Lane for a friendly in the mid-00s and it was a fantastic ground as well.

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                                #16
                                Out of the frying pan and into the fire. Bolton's new owner is Bassini.

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