I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

[Ibn Pickthall]

A list of brands not to be covered head to toe in.What's the criteria for inclusion? It seems entirely random - a label that takes its name aprtly from French student riots? Really?

I'm really dismayed to see Paul Smith amongst them.

[The Exploding Vole]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

It's unlikely Paul Smith would join the Ultras, I think.

[Bored Of Education]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

New Balance are Jack daps as well

[ursus arctos]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Fjall Raven?

Aren't the Danish required to wear their anoraks under pain of imprisonment?

Are the brands paying to be associated with the muppets, or are the latter doing it on their own?

[delicatemoth]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Good grief.

"Stone Island was founded in 1982 by Massimo Osti who was inspired by his love of sailing, and hence the famous compass motif. In the nineties and noughties, if you were serious about about having a row - this was the brand to be seen in. SI Have long revoultionised the area of garment engineering, creating highly sought-after pieces in the process. The robust design, hard wearing fabric and high quality finish had made this brand a mainstay in Football Casual fashion.

The compass motif badge is an optional button-on with the jackets. Although historically a status symbol amongst the Football Casual crowd, the brand can now be seen more widely in popular culture and therefore is rapidly losing it's status amongst the Football Casual elite. Some fear the saturation of fakes on eBay have damaged the brand beyond repair."

That made me laugh uncontrollably, but at the same time -

[Ibn Pickthall]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

You think that's funny? I can't tell you how many times I've read the Victorinox piece, especially the last line.

Victorinox clothing only came into the Football Casual consciousness in recent years. The ethos of high quality finish, functional design and clean lines appeal to those looking for a clinical style. Some casuals have gone as far to suggest that Victorinox has every chance of toppling Stone Island as the most definitive Casual brand, but only time can tell if the brand's attraction will be a mainstay. We recommend jackets, knitwear and polos

Massimo Osti must be disstraught that his label is in danger of being passed over for the knitwear of a cutler.

[kugelrund]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

What's the criteria for inclusion?

If it's available on Oi Polloi, it's on the list?

[Ball Comrade]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I bought my fjällraven jacket half price at this place:

http://www.tuuri.fi/en/kylakauppa/etusivu

The wild Statue of Liberty of Finnish commerce – Brothers Keskinen Ltd., the biggest VillageShop in Finland, the Legend of the plains, the Pearl of Ostrobothnia, the miraculous Department Store in the backwoods - a beloved child has many names - rises at the gate of Southern Ostrobothnia, in the middle of nowhere. It is very difficult to describe this department store of the new generation with words; it must be experienced personally.

I hope that 'damages the brand' sufficiently to get it removed from the list.

[Jorge Porbillas]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

There's a subtle difference between 'dressing for the match' i.e. casual culture, and hooliganism, though, surely?

[Reed John]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I still don't understand what a "football casual" is supposed to refer to or why they're called "casuals" when it seems that they're pretty hardcore as fans go.

[Incandenza]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I've never heard of Paul and Shark before. At first I thought that was a logo for Greg Norman's polo shirt company.

[ursus arctos]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Paul and Shark are Italian, and have their roots in yachting clothes (or clothes for people who want you to think they have yachts). Sort of like a more expensive and more stylish Nautica; not as "technical" as Helly Hansen.

The "casual" comes from the idea that the "elite core of hooligans" would wear stylish (and relatively expensive) "casual" clothing, as opposed to yer usual yoof clobber. Pringle sweaters were de rigeur back in the day, which was hilarious for someone like me who associated them with wimpish preppies and geriatric golfers.

[Jorge Porbillas]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

ursus arctos wrote:

The "casual" comes from the idea that the "elite core of hooligans" would wear stylish (and relatively expensive) "casual" clothing, as opposed to yer usual yoof clobber.

Again, I take issue with the assumption that casual=hooligan, especially from a lover of Italian football like yourself ursus, who has spent many a year on OTF explaining the difference between ultra and hooligan ...

[Bored Of Education]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Certainly, I knew casuals in the 80s who weren't even into football just into the clothes, hairstyles and, unfortunately, Level 42

[ursus arctos]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Jorge, I was trying to explain the derivation of the word to Reed, who is many years behind the two of us in experience of such matters and was asking about the use of the term in relation to hooligans.

But yes, there were/are certainly "casuals" who were/are not "hooligans" and vice versa.

Sorry if I gave anyone a different impression.

[Reed John]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I find that to be a very strange fashion trend. I guess the Mods had similar style. Perhaps its the same people. If the idea is to look "upper class" then you're not fooling anyone. If the idea is to mock the upper class, then more power to you, but the joke wears thin.

As UA says, we associate that sort of thing with preppies who think this is still the 1920s and orther kinds of posh people who use summer as a verb.

I'm generally not fond of golf shirts. They seem like such a half-ass gesture toward "dressing-up."

[ursus arctos]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

As has been demonstrated in numerous past threads, British men are much more fashion conscious than North American men. Or perhaps more accurately, a significantly greater proportion of Brits are fashion conscious.

Some of the fads are completely bizarre, but that's true of fads in general, and a big part of why they are fads.

[sw2borshch]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I'm slightly dismayed to find Fjallraven on there as the winter coat I bought of theirs two years ago is the warmest I've ever had, and as I'm due a new one was likely to get another. Luckily I understand that Carhartt is recognised as very much a non-soccer thug brand and as my arse is often covered by them I'm unlikely to be considered a member of this elite.

And whilst I'm not sure how fashion-conscious yer average North American male is, ursus is certainly right that many British males are. My town, although a working class place battered by recession after recession, has a number of gentleman's outfitters out of proportion to the size and economy of the area, but there's a very definite culture of dressing, how you say, ghetto fabulous.

A young East German lady of my acquaintance many years did comment on her visit here that it was strange to see so many young men who actually dressed their hair, which may say more about Dresden than Middlesbrough.

[Jorge Porbillas]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

ursus arctos wrote:

Sorry if I gave anyone a different impression.

no need to apologise - my bad!

Reed John wrote:

I find that to be a very strange fashion trend. I guess the Mods had similar style. Perhaps its the same people. If the idea is to look "upper class" then you're not fooling anyone. If the idea is to mock the upper class, then more power to you, but the joke wears thin.

I think it's fair to say there is a strong mod/casual crossover

[ursus arctos]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

How would that work, Jorge?

Were there casuals in the 60s? Or are we talking about younger brothers, or older Mods?

[Jorge Porbillas]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Not sure if casuals are/were mods back in the day, it's just that a lot of people I'd consider to be casuals are also into their scooters and all things Lambretta! I think it's more the idea of dressing to look good be it for a gig/Saturday night (like mods) or for the football on a Saturday afternoon (like casuals).

Also, as Bored alluded to up-thread, each club have their own little fad - New Balance are Jack Daps and as far as I'm concerned, Nike daps are worn by Cockneys! I remember Liverpool wearing those awful Benetton rugby shirts, which they stopped wearing as soon as everybody else started wearing them.

I know it sounds ridiculous, but if you break it down, all fashion is ludicrous and all fads are ridiculous!

[Bored Of Education]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

The Ben Sherman/Fred Perry endorsement certainly suggests a mod legacy as does an attention to detail and label conciousness but, as I recall, in the 80s, casuals wore non-mod stuff like Farah, Lacoste, Fila etc. Also the Farahs, cords etc split at the bottom so that they covered the tongue and laces of the trainer wasn't at all a Mod look. The wedge haircuts were possibly an evolution of the mod style

[Anton Gramscescu]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

Italian Ultra Fahsion alert: Frankie Garage is really, really, really shit. I hadn't really fully grokked that until today.

[AMMS]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

I was sort of a casual. I wasn't into the fighting much, at least not by Glasgow standards, but certainly the fashion aspect was where I was at in the mid 80s. My understanding of the 'casuals' name and style was that it evolved from English club sides, Liverpool in particular, travelling to European away matches. Gangs of fans were becoming easy to spot by local police so they stopped wearing team colours. They then went on shop lifting sprees which is where a lot of the European fashions came in. Brands such as Lacoste and Tachini were pretty much out of reach for your average British teenager which gave those that stole them even more incentive to bring them home.

I know of a Rangers supporters bus that went to European away ties purely for the shop lifting. Various members of that bus would take orders for clothes before heading away. I worked with one of them for a while and he told bizarre stories of trying to go shoplifting in Bucharest and Kiev in the time of the Soviet Union.

In my memory the 'casual' thing seemed to come out of nowhere, one minute all the mad guys were wearing docs and scarves tied to every appendage they had at the games and the next they were sporting pink deerstalkers and Italian tracksuits and the smallest Rangers (insert any Scottish team here) buttonhole badge you could find. Either way they still stuck out like sore thumbs.

[Incandenza]

I just don't understand the Ultra Couture

What are "Jack daps?"
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The thought of some tough intimidating guy wearing a Lacoste shirt is frankly laughable to me.