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    #26
    Originally posted by Ginger Yellow View Post

    I understand all that, intellectually, I just don't care. There was a lot of stuff like this on the Mandalorian, actually, except I'm even less familiar with all the non-movie lore. It seems the Disney+ shows are very much going for people who are neck deep in it.
    You don’t need to be neck deep. Maybe waist deep, though.

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      #27
      Originally posted by Ginger Yellow View Post
      Legion did that do better effect, I thought.
      I gave up on that. It just got too dense and plodding.

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        #28
        Having only watched the first Avengers movie, I wasn't completely au fait with the lore going into this. I also have an aversion to this 'unfolding mystery' style of show after watching Lost and finding that to be insulting to my intelligence.
        I've really enjoyed it though, and in terms of filling in gaps, had to spend fewer than five minutes doing so.
        I'm not sure about the criticism of it referring to the universe it is a part of. If anything, I'm inclined to go back and watch the avengers films I have yet to see.
        As always, investing a little time has paid dividends.
        edit: the two lead actors were what kept me watching initially, they're very good.
        Last edited by Mr Delicieux; 07-02-2021, 16:58.

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          #29
          What makes me wonder about Jarvis/Vision is that we see the flesh and blood Jarvis is Avengers: Endgame, Jarvis computer is clearly his voice and Vision uses Jarvis' programming to gain sentience, is this the equivalent of the comic version of the Vision getting Wonder Man's brain pattern as his personality (which is why poor old Wonder Man falls in love with his "brother's" wife), but it's Howard Stark's late driver/valet's brain pattern instead?

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            #30
            I've been watching the Agent Carter series and Jarvis makes a comment about how terrible it would be to end up as a disembodied voice. I don't think "Jarvis" the computer system belonging to Iron Man is meant to be a preserved version of Jarvis the butler when Vision is created in Age of Ultron.

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              #31
              I've binge-watched the first five and greatly enjoyed them, to an extent for the reveal but mostly the acuity of the parody, especially the opening credits. I'm not in the least bit au fait with the Marvel universe and not particularly bothered about getting up to speed with all that. Actually, I find the sci-fi elements a bit dull tbh, there's acres of that sort of stuff out there. Indeed, when the series took the turn it did in season 4 I wondered if they were now parodying late 20th century sci-fi.

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                #32
                Originally posted by wingco View Post
                I wondered if they were now parodying late 20th century sci-fi.
                I wouldn't have thought of it myself, but now that you mention it, I'd have to say... Yes, they are.

                Off the top of my head: random group of specialists brought together to investigate a 'paranormal' activity. Military encampment encircling said activity. The introduction of the 'protaganist' is a literal walk-and-talk through a nondescript government building. Young attractive female scientist speaking in mumbo-jumbo (but that the 'head' of said agency immediately understands).... I mean, that could be describing X-Files or any similar show/movie of the era, right?

                Now, is it totally an intentional parody or just that that is the 'language' sci-fi uses for these scenarios now? Not sure. Both?

                The other thing I'd have to mention is that this entire show is massive flex by Disney to show just how far their reach is. Parody of old TV shows? Sure. Mimic the sets and costumes to the point of it being carbon copy? Yeah. Bring in a cast from multiple individual franchises and have them interact? Why not. Re-use an actor from the other franchise from the studio we just bought for the characters we now own? Definitely.

                I mean, I still think it's clever as heck, but it is also Disney showing off in the extreme. Hasn't reduced my enjoyment yet.

                And Bettany and Olsen are just killing it. I hope they get some award recognition, because I really think they deserve it. (and the supporting cast? Sheesh, the comedy relief in the office just had a 30 second clip he can live off for future casting sessions.)
                Last edited by matt j; 08-02-2021, 16:03.

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                  #33
                  I mean, I still think it's clever as heck, but it is also Disney showing off in the extreme. Hasn't reduced my enjoyment yet.

                  This could be the Disney corporate motto, perfected at their theme parks. They know what people want, even if people wish they didn't want it. Same with Pixar.
                  Last edited by Hot Pepsi; 08-02-2021, 18:49.

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                    #34
                    Like with the Mandalorian. The core nerd 40 year fanboys and fangirls totally fucking loved it. Will it bring new people in? Yes, because they all have kids and grandkids now. Disney don't need to grow their market; they just need to keep them happy.

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                      #35
                      Speaking as a core 40 something fanboy (I object to the term nerd, how very dare you) I was marking out over the latest poster and trailer for The Falcon and The Winter Soldier with the appearance of properly hooded Baron Zemo, what looks like Sin and something to do with the Flag Smasher, the welcome return of Agent 13 (Sharon Carter) and the US Agent! I hope he's as Lawful Neutral as his comic counterpart (plus the odd dash of Chaos hurled in due to the mental trauma of seeing his parents murdered by extreme right wing militia).
                      Last edited by Eggchaser; 09-02-2021, 14:51.

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                        #36
                        By nerd I was covering the Star Wars fanbase, Eggs, not your good self or any other comic book dweebs.

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                          #37
                          Nerrrrrrrrrrrd!

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                            #38
                            I'm not really familiar with 95% of Mavel lore, but I am certainly familiar with the overall form of comic book stories, where the stories go on an on for decades and all connect and intersect and even branch into multiple universes and versions which are routinely retconned in and out of the "canon." Star Wars seems to be becoming more like that too, though not nearly so complicated. Yet.

                            I don't think one has to actually know all of the lore to appreciate Wandavision or any of the Marvel movies, but you do have to be open to that kind of branching non-linear story creation.

                            But complicated stories are not at all unique to comic books or scifi/fantasy. For example, I recently watched The Maltese Falcon for the second time and still don't really understand the plot.

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                              #39
                              It doesn't help that comics simply reboot, retcon and reimagine on a regular basis, if only for the fact that characters who emerged in the 1930s are still looking pretty sprightly decades later.

                              Or characters dying. There was a saying that in comics, only Uncle Ben, Gwen Stacey and Bucky were dead forever, and the latter two have defied that. Need to bring back a character who has been dead for years? Oh, that was a Skrull who imitating them that died. Or a clone. Or from another universe. Or they weren't dead, just in a coma (Captain America, we're looking at you. You too, Wonder Man. And Bucky.). Or they were dead, but science and/or magic has resurrected them. Or they were lost in another dimension, or the Speed Force.

                              Villains are worse. A lot of them in the old days were largely meant to be one shot antagonists, never to be heard of again, either through death or jail. The Joker was going to be killed at the end of his second appearance but was spared because the editor liked the character. Hell, there was a joke about it in a West Coast Avengers comic years ago, Magneto was hurled into a smokestack which exploded. Iron Man reported that he couldn't see any evidence of survival, 'but do we think he's dead this time?“ Teammates: "Naaaaaaa!“

                              Even characters who were killed off because the readers hated them sometimes get a reprieve (hello Jason Todd).

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                                #40
                                There's a semi official term for how, even without official reboots, the characters didn't age much. But I forget what that is.
                                Like Batman was roughly in his early 30s and about 10 years into his Batmanning career, for about 50 years. Everyone just accepted that. What was or wasn't canon didn't really become an issue until the 70s, as I recall.



                                Jason Todd is the Red Hood now, isn't he?

                                I haven't really read comics in about 10 years. I had three comic reading phases. Ages 3-4 (just looked at the pictures, so 1975-1977) Ages 12-17 (way into them, 1984-1989) and then again from about 2000-2010.

                                It just takes to much time and money to keep up with all the stories. I'm ok just seeing the films and TV shows. That's about all the time commitment I want to give them. I'll occasionally read a graphic novel as I would any book, but I can't keep up with series let alone whole universes.

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                                  #41
                                  I'm watching episode 6 - no spoilers, no worries! - and my only gripe is Kat Dennings playing Kat Dennings, as she has done in everything I've seen her in from the 40 year old virgin, 2 broke girls through to this, which ain't no thing in the latter features, but isn't so convincing when you're playing the part of a technically savvy genius.

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                                    #42
                                    I don't think it's a spoiler to say that when Quicksilver turned up dressed as FUCKING QUICKSILVER I had to pause the show to explain to my wife why my thirteen year old self was reclaiming my forty something brain in a nerdgasm of bongo vid proportions.

                                    This is the best television I have seen in ages, and having to wait for the next episode is fantastically old school and maddening in equal measure.

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                                      #43
                                      Ah I guessed the blue outfit was an original comic book outfit. Was Wanda's red outfit a throwback to a comic book look as well?

                                      Spoiler (in white text)

                                      Pietro's line about being shot dead in the street like a chump will have been enjoyed by the people who were pissed off he was killed in Age of Ultron.

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                                        #44
                                        Yes, both Wanda and Vision were wearing the costumes (slightly dorky in Vision's case) they had from the comics. And the twins had crude versions of their costumes from when they become Wiccan and Speed.

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                                          #45
                                          Episode 6
                                          - DOPE

                                          It's all brilliant, it's all dope, it's all this and that and that and this.

                                          What can you say. It's turning out as brilliant as you thought it would.

                                          As brilliant as the actors are...now the twins are as Walter Whited Malcomed In the Middled awesome as anything else.

                                          I always said the Sopranos and Wire were the Rolling Stones and Beatles. Then Breaking Bad was Led Zepplin. Now we're up to Nirvana.

                                          I think we have our answer as to why it's a sitcom. She was driving her car on the edge of town. But I won't say more, because there's 3 more episodes and it's all so much fun.
                                          Last edited by jason voorhees; 13-02-2021, 20:30.

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                                            #46
                                            So genuine question, all the reviewers keep saying Malcolm in the Middle, but I kept thinking Pete & Pete (or even a bit My So Called Life). But I never watched enough of Pete & Pete to swear by it. Wasn't there another show before Malcom that did the 'talking to the handheld camera' thing too?

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                                              #47
                                              Twitter thinks the witch's hat was a big clue as to who she is, and the other one that recently arrived is Marvel's version of the Devil.

                                              And the "aerospace engineer" might turn out to be a pretty flexible fellow.

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                                                #48
                                                I say Malcolm in the Middle because of Walter White. The Vision as Hal is a perfectly perfect path to walk in. The boys were also given so much power in this show like Malcolm. Then it leaves room for who will be Walter White. The show is so imbedded in tv history, that the plot elements are contingent upon the passage of time on the boob tube. (American, of course, but like The Office, would love to see the British version of this show.)

                                                Wanda Max brushing her teeth in horror in the intro was so great. Each era has a specific bearing on the show. This episode was about the empowering of youth, as Malcolm in the Middle was.

                                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cqys_psQ3Bo

                                                Like I said, there will be books upon books written about this show, from sociologists to tv historians to family guidance counselors to whatever. Every scene is loaded to the hilt and then some.

                                                What's utterly hilarious is that any parent will have wondered when a crying baby will stop, then all of a sudden they're 4 then 10. Shit like that is a kiss to any parent. Then these poor children, aging 10 years in 6 days...and having the concern and love and devotion to their parents as if they lived 10 years. Which in retrospect is pretty much how childhood feels.

                                                Now add The Truman Show...and up the Twilight Zone factor...and it's so much fun. Popcorn trucks and hot air balloons and clowns and circus tent fun. PLEASE Wanda turn all of New Jersey to West of NYC View.
                                                Last edited by jason voorhees; 13-02-2021, 23:41.

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                                                  #49
                                                  Originally posted by matt j View Post
                                                  So genuine question, all the reviewers keep saying Malcolm in the Middle, but I kept thinking Pete & Pete (or even a bit My So Called Life). But I never watched enough of Pete & Pete to swear by it. Wasn't there another show before Malcom that did the 'talking to the handheld camera' thing too?
                                                  All of those, to some extent, and maybe Parker Lewis Can’t Lose but overall it seemed to mostly match Malcom in the Middle.

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                                                    #50
                                                    The font was almost identical, and the song would've inspired a winning lawsuit by Marvin Gaye's family.

                                                    ​​​​​​https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHzKeyYbOHw - Wanda Ep 6 opening

                                                    ​​​​​​https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULY81UJZufk - Malcolm Middle opening

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