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    #26
    I loved the first book, enjoyed the second and third, gave up somewhere around four. Definitely diminishing returns. But that was nerdy teenage me who loved nerdy epic SF. I was also totally in love with Asimov’s Foundation series. Never saw the Lynch Dune - my Lynch period came well after my Dune period, and by the time I might have been interested I’d been put off by the reputation.

    Totally loved Arrival. Never saw BR2049 (I’m one of those nerds who was underwhelmed by the original BR, particularly compared to the book).

    I’m only medium excited. Films of books I loved as a youngster tend to underwhelm me.

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      #27
      Originally posted by Levin View Post
      Sci-Fi writer Adam Roberts retweeted an interesting thread about Judaism and Dune. It's the only religion to make it's its way to Dune's present untouched. The Bene Gesserit meddle and shape all the other world religions to suit their purpose. The Jewish people who do pop up in the books are a little, stereotyped.

      I probably read Dune too young, it was fun but I raced through books on the surface then.
      The Bene Gesserit are a political group rather than religious. They only use religion as a tool to wield power against others, but eschew it themselves.
      I'm sure I read that they were based on the author's Catholic Aunts though.
      Judaism as that article says, doesn't come up until the last book. And it's handled as cack-handedly and poorly as the rest of the last book is. Herbert's abilities certainly waned in later life.

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        #28
        God I'd forgotten the whole Jewish subplot in Chapterhouse. Up there with the whole Honoured Matres Sex kick for the worst bit of nonsense in the series. The only good bit in the last book is the two wee Face Dancers in their garden at the end.

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          #29
          Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
          Totally loved Arrival. Never saw BR2049 (I’m one of those nerds who was underwhelmed by the original BR, particularly compared to the book).
          2049 is very different. There is definitely a connection to the first film. Not seeing Blade Runner would make 2049 less enjoyable but I think the film is a very different story. It's not currently on any of the regular streaming/movie channels, so only PPV. I assume it will come to Prime or Netflix at some point, so I would recommend giving it a go. I never read Dick's short story so have nothing to compare (as I wrote in another thread about books/films). I loved the first film, so maybe am not the best judge. Haha.

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            #30
            Dave Bautista is going to be the common thread between Blade Runner 2049 and Dune, cast-wise, but I couldn't work out who he is in Dune. Surely not Feyd Rautha? I looked it up and realised he is playing Rabban, the other Harkonnen scion. And there's nobody else listed for Feyd?

            Found this blog post asking the same question. Where is Feyd?
            https://jamesworrad.com/2020/03/08/d...e-fck-is-feyd/

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              #31
              Originally posted by danielmak View Post

              2049 is very different. There is definitely a connection to the first film. Not seeing Blade Runner would make 2049 less enjoyable but I think the film is a very different story. It's not currently on any of the regular streaming/movie channels, so only PPV. I assume it will come to Prime or Netflix at some point, so I would recommend giving it a go. I never read Dick's short story so have nothing to compare (as I wrote in another thread about books/films). I loved the first film, so maybe am not the best judge. Haha.
              Blade Runner is one of the few movies I have owned on VHS, DVD and Blu-ray. And yet, it has issues... anyway, people might enjoy BR2049 without seeing Blade Runner. They may even enjoy it more because the worst callbacks won't jar so much.

              The book is very different to the movie. I wouldn't recommend people read the book if they loved the film.

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                #32
                Another article - which discusses how Jodorowsky's Dune would have ended. (All I can say is, thank fuck that never got made. )
                https://www.inverse.com/entertainmen...jodorowsky/amp

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                  #33
                  Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post
                  Dave Bautista is going to be the common thread between Blade Runner 2049 and Dune, cast-wise, but I couldn't work out who he is in Dune. Surely not Feyd Rautha? I looked it up and realised he is playing Rabban, the other Harkonnen scion. And there's nobody else listed for Feyd?

                  Found this blog post asking the same question. Where is Feyd?
                  https://jamesworrad.com/2020/03/08/d...e-fck-is-feyd/
                  I think the film could consolidate the two Harkonin princes.

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                    #34
                    That rather misses the point, then.

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                      #35
                      Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post
                      Dave Bautista is going to be the common thread between Blade Runner 2049 and Dune, cast-wise, but I couldn't work out who he is in Dune. Surely not Feyd Rautha? I looked it up and realised he is playing Rabban, the other Harkonnen scion. And there's nobody else listed for Feyd?

                      Found this blog post asking the same question. Where is Feyd?
                      https://jamesworrad.com/2020/03/08/d...e-fck-is-feyd/
                      Negotiations with Sting are still ongoing.

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                        #36
                        As long as he keeps his clothes on.

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                          #37
                          Originally posted by Eggchaser View Post
                          That rather misses the point, then.
                          Yes, that's one of the subplots isn't it - Rabban wanting to earn Baron Harkonnen's favour and him preferring Feyd.

                          I did like the comment in the article suggesting it could be a late reveal and turn out to be Justin Bieber.

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                            #38
                            Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post

                            Yes, that's one of the subplots isn't it - Rabban wanting to earn Baron Harkonnen's favour and him preferring Feyd.

                            I did like the comment in the article suggesting it could be a late reveal and turn out to be Justin Bieber.
                            The Baron explicitly sets up Rabban as a fall guy in his stewardship of Arrakis, with the idea that when Rabban gets the boot for incompetence and brutality the people will welcome Feyd as a saviour (of sorts).

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                              #39
                              Originally posted by Eggchaser View Post

                              The Baron explicitly sets up Rabban as a fall guy in his stewardship of Arrakis, with the idea that when Rabban gets the boot for incompetence and brutality the people will welcome Feyd as a saviour (of sorts).
                              I hope that isn't cut, but I think that's a subplot that doesn't necessarily need to be in the film. Or it could be done another way somehow. Like the princess - a fairly useless character in the first book - is set up to be the good cop to Rabban's bad cop. Or something like that.

                              To make films like this, the studio needs to make like $150m or more in the first week or so, as I understand it. So that means it it has to play to an international audience in theaters. It can't be too complex for distracted teenagers to understand. It can't be four hours long. It just won't be able to include all the feints within feints within feints.

                              Of course, if it turns out that everyone is just forced to watch this at home anyway, the filmmakers will regret that they didn't just make it an HBO miniseries where they would have had more time for that kind of thing.

                              It's also possible, as that article suggests, that Feyd just won't show up until the sequel. I think that would make sense. My recollection is that he's only referred to for most of the book before arriving rather late. Indeed, in the 80s film, Sting is only on the poster because he was, at that time, by far the most famous person in the film. He doesn't do much until the final scenes.

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                                #40
                                I reckon they might just simplify it and have Rabban v Paul as the main focus of the conflict.

                                I also suspect Duncan Idaho might have a bigger role in this film given that Jason Momoa is playing him. But then Oscar Isaac is a big name as Duke Leto and surely he won't get much screen time after the first 25 minutes or so.

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                                  #41
                                  Indeed, there are so many characters that Paul and his mom are really the only ones that get a lot of screen time, so it's impressive they got so many big names across the board.

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                                    #42
                                    They may have sold it as, "It's a small part but a good character to get your teeth into".

                                    No doubt the internet will be awash with "WTF THEY KILLED DUNCAN?" from people who don't know the story, in similar fashion to Eddard Stark getting the chop in GOT.

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                                      #43
                                      One difference between the book and the 1984 film is actually seeing Duncan die. In the book he disappears presumed dead which adds to the sense of chaos as Jessica flees with Paul.

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                                        #44
                                        I thought that he was described as getting a head injury that killed him, but that may be tidying up in a later book.

                                        In any case, he is likely to get his Crowning Moment of Awesome as he beats the shit out of the Saudarkar before being overwhelmed.

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                                          #45
                                          Doesn’t he come back as a clone, or am I thinking of somebody else?

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                                            #46
                                            Yes, he comes back as a 'ghola' ie clone in Children of Dune as a gift to Leto II, I think. Then there is a subplot in God Emperor of Dune about how there has been a string of gholas as they gradually become more aware of their past and turn against Leto so he has them killed off and replaced with a new one.

                                            I thought he was just written out as being in a flier that came under heavy fire and crashed while distracting the Harkonnen forces so that Jessica could escape with Paul. In the 1984 movie he dies on screen wearing the block armour which slows down but doesn't stop the bullet that kills him. It's a very effective scene in the film.

                                            (I realise that we are in spoiler territory here, but if people haven't read the book or seen previous screen adaptations, then how much obligation do we have to protect them. It's not like we are walking out of the cinema past the people in line for the next screening saying "I can't believe Darth Vader is Luke's father" a la Homer Simpson.)
                                            Patrick Thistle
                                            Last edited by Patrick Thistle; 16-09-2020, 13:15.

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                                              #47
                                              Yeah, he dies heroically after killing nineteen Sardaukar.

                                              Who was the guy that they thought was a traitor but turned out not to be?

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                                                #48
                                                t's not like we are walking out of the cinema past the people in line for the next screening saying "I can't believe Darth Vader is Luke's father"
                                                Oh, you absolute...

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                                                  #49
                                                  Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                                  Yeah, he dies heroically after killing nineteen Sardaukar.

                                                  Who was the guy that they thought was a traitor but turned out not to be?
                                                  That was the planetologist I think. Gurney Halleck hides with the Fremen.
                                                  (Spoilers)
                                                  The mentat was the traitor because his wife was being held prisoner by House Harkonnen.

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                                                    #50
                                                    Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                                    Yeah, he dies heroically after killing nineteen Sardaukar.

                                                    Who was the guy that they thought was a traitor but turned out not to be?
                                                    Or Dr Yueh, who tried to play the long game against the Baron after being compromised into betrayal.

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