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    I saw Doctor of Mine, David Tennant and Jessica Hynes trending on Twitter, and it looked like there was a new series or spin-off. What is that about? Nothing?

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      There was a bit in the Big Night In thing on Thursday night apparently.

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        Ah, thanks. I thought I was missing something major.

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          I've been watching some old who recently. I've never seen much beyond some Baker Who when it was on Gold. I watched Planet of Fear, Castrovalva, Four for Apocalypse & Kinda. The ideas in the Davidson ones were much better that I remember from Baker but Planet of Fear looks sooo much better that the later episodes. From direction to set dressing. It's all relative of course, the captains bridge in Planet of Fear is a chrome chair and desk but still.

          Oh dear god, Adric and Teagan are annoying. Oh so annoying. There are moments for Teagan but mostly she's a pain. Oh and Four for Apocalypse had a ridiculous moment where Teagan demonstrated her ability to speak an aboriginal language (spoken by a 40,000 year old man) because she's Australian. Which I guess is a nice thought but just stupid.

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            Originally posted by Levin View Post
            Four for Apocalypse had a ridiculous moment where Teagan demonstrated her ability to speak an aboriginal language (spoken by a 40,000 year old man) because she's Australian. Which I guess is a nice thought but just stupid.
            I see that and raise you Capaldi Doctor being able to "speak dinosaur" in his first episode

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              Originally posted by elguapo4 View Post
              Matt Smith was a good Doctor, but I found Amy and Rory annoying in the extreme, a lot of their plots I just didn't care about, when Rory turned up dressed as a Roman legionnaire all I could think of was Rodney Trotter in the last Only Fools episode.
              Oh god, yes, I couldn't stand Rory. Up till then I was really enjoying the Matt Smith run. The actor, Arthur Darville, then turned up in Legends of Tomorrow, basically playing a poor man's Dr Who.

              Originally posted by Levin View Post
              I've watched a selection of Smith and Tennant episodes over the past few days and it's a bit cringy how all the women fall in love with him (except Donna so far). Rose, Sarah-Jane, Martha, Amy & River. Have I missed anyone?
              Oh god, yes. Cringy in the extreme. I was so pleased that they got an older doctor in after Matt Smith to avoid more of the same.

              Anyway, I have just watched the first two episodes in the last series - Spyfall parts one and two. Best Who I've seen for a while. They had clearly pulled out all the stops for them. Great location shots, big budget effects and big guest names. Plus it was a pretty well-paced and an exciting story with a good script. The Facebook/Google analog was a really interesting idea to explore. The only negative thing that really stood out for me were the companions. First time I'd really seen them but I thought they brought very little to the story. Reading the comments on this thread after those first two episodes has made me think it'd probably be best if I just cut my losses and don't continue to watch any more of the series now.

              Last edited by Jon; 19-10-2020, 20:35.

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                Going back to Spyfall they never resolved Lenny Henry's character being 7% alien or something.

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                  The Ribos Operation is the first fun, entertaining story in ages.

                  The previous few have been bad to ok. Sadly Ribos still has K9. Although, the concepts in Underworld are probably well worth digging into.

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                    Baker really doesn't mind guns just so long as the beings with them follow his orders to the letter.

                    City of Death is brilliant. A first draft to Dirk Gently.

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                        Hmmm

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                          The theme tune in this final Baker series is not very good. I've just got to Aldric and he is dragging the life out of these episodes.

                          Lot's of very Adam's concepts in these series, a ship that people have lost the manual for that they're forever getting ready, a suburban English man kidnapped to be possessed.

                          I keep seeing flashes of early Games Workshop art in the set and costume design, of course it's the other way around but I've never seen it before.

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                            Originally posted by Levin View Post
                            The theme tune in this final Baker series is not very good
                            Aw no, I love the early 80's electronic theme. I mean, it shouldn't work - it ditched all the wonderful things about the existing theme tune, a masterpiece of 60's musique concrete radiophonica - but in the hands of skilled composer Peter Howell a classic was reborn, with a savage sting, a pulsating analogue bassline, eerie processed electric guitar and, just when you think it's all over, an electronic eruption that Trevor Horn would've killed to have on one of his productions.

                            I've just got to Aldric and he is dragging the life out of these episodes
                            'Aldric'? A hybrid of Adric and Blackadder's Baldrick?

                            Lot's of very Adam's concepts in these series, a ship that people have lost the manual for that they're forever getting ready, a suburban English man kidnapped to be possessed
                            Douglas Adams had departed by season 18 - as far as I know all the stories were commissioned by his successor Christopher H. Bidmead, who we can blame credit for the season's surfeit of high-science concepts.

                            I keep seeing flashes of early Games Workshop art in the set and costume design, of course it's the other way around but I've never seen it before
                            Intriguing. Which stories in particular?

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                              I don't know how to talk about music but it's that the tune is slightly uptempo and the key change (?) In the base feels a bit status quo.

                              I do like the higher concept stuff, I've been groaning inwardly whenever I see Terence Dick's name. Did I mention up thread how much I loved the earth con men?

                              I think it's the headwear that gives me the strongest 40k vibes. The Leisure Hive had a helmet that would have suited an Elder perfectly. There were some other helmets that people were wearing that had a piping around the edge that screamed Rogue Trader.

                              There also seems to be a lot of raiding the costume drama wardrobe which lends a slightly gothic look, like the planet Nyssa is from. Some of the alien and creature designs are very limited by what the designers can do but there are notes that carry on into Citadel. How much of that is direct Who to GW And how much Is just that was fashion at the time I don't know.

                              Having thrown shade on Dicks I do love low tech world's in a sci fi universe like the vampire planet, even the pirate planet, the Ribos Operation was brilliant all around.

                              A lot of the stories seem to have civilisations on their last legs or trying to recapture past glories.

                              All of which is very much my feeling of 40k as well as opposed to the more modern over the top look and feel.

                              Man, Adric might have been annoying but what a way to get rid of him! For nothing. Failing to do something he didn't need to do. And next episode, oh let's go to Crystal Palace to get over it.

                              I want to like Davidson, and he's genuinely good but there isn't enough contrast within episodes to really let his portrayal shine. I can understand him being short and annoyed a lot but they could have shown moments of why he liked his companions.

                              Companions who can talk as equals, even if in only certain areas, are a delight. Hmm, maybe these are the moments I was mentioning that were missing in the previous paragraph. As is a fallible, sometimes not knowing Doctor.

                              Oh and give me the Cybermen from Earth Shock over the bipedal Daleks of New Who any day.

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                                It's the Gallifreyan security/soldiers that made me think of Rogue Trader, their helmets especially.

                                I've finally got David Agnew's nom de plume on here with these catch ups.

                                There was a run of serials where women were show as being in powerful roles or even just an equal number compared to men. In particular I really enjoyed the captain and first officer of the freighter in Earthshock. The captain was a proper, Kirk style, damn your procedures woman but that seems to have passed and we're back to men all over the place with a token woman if you're lucky.

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                                  Oh dear, the stories get really tiresome towards the back end of Davidson's run. There are some decent performances but they can't save it. I also wished they showed why the Doctor had the companions along rather than him being perpetually annoyed with them until they leave and then he's sad.

                                  Finally, OMG, Peri is one for the dad's isn't she? Incredibly sexualised in her first appearance

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                                    Is Colin Baker, good?

                                    He's very new Doctor. The most like the new doctor's I've seen.

                                    I mean, it's not very good as a program but still.

                                    Martin Jarvis should be the baddie in more things.

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                                      Can I just say that Strax is hilarious when you're three sheets to the wind?

                                      We will melt him with acid.

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                                        Watched a couple of season 5 episodes today on Dave, they weren't bad but Amy and Rory are still the most annoying companions of all the series. We're about to head into the totally confusing Stephen Moffitt episodes with River Song and Rory as a Roman soldier. No thanks, once was enough for that shit.

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                                          Season 5 was the one where the true test of love in every episode was WAITING A VERY LONG TIME FOR SOMEONE!!!! I reckon Stephen Moffat was in a relationship with someone who took ages getting ready to go out and he was pacing the floor of the hall wondering what the fuck was taking them so long.

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                                            Strax is a delight, in small doses.

                                            I liked the Smith series much more on second time through.

                                            I've tried to be forgiving of small budgets but these Cybermen are just wearing spray painted batting gloves.

                                            I think Colin Baker was very hard done by but then you get to McCoy and he's just so much better.

                                            I like all the modern references I pick up. Like a series about vegetarianism or Bonnie Langford doing aerobics. On which note, she's not as annoying as I was expecting.

                                            Oh Alexi Sayle has been the biggest surprise appearance.

                                            Edit. Is it a coincidence that a lot of the half arsedest ones were during a period where there were two episodes a week?
                                            Last edited by Levin; 15-10-2020, 19:33.

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                                              I don't think the production schedule altered with the transmission schedules.

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                                                Yeah, I think they were rushing the episodes out but they'd already been filmed. It wasn't a concurrent filming-screening arrangement like a soap or US sitcom.

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                                                  I stopped watching Who regularly during Peter Capaldi's stint, but yesterday put on an episode to watch. It was called The Magicians Apprentice and was from his second season.

                                                  Anyway (spoilers) it's basically the philosophical question of if you knew a child would grow up to be evil would/ should/ could you kill that child? In this case the child is Davros.

                                                  I've had a couple of thoughts here. One is that modern Who keeps messing with the canon. I know people didn't like River Song much, and the Weeping Angels got seriously overdone by the end, but at least they were new elements to be explored. But going back to long established stories like Davros and retconning them every time is less interesting.

                                                  The second thought was that this story illustrates the fundamental moral problem of having a being who is virtually eternal and can travel through time. Given that he is supposed to be the good guy, the Doctor shrugs off an awful lot of deaths and doesn't act to prevent them happening. How much moral complicity does he take in those deaths? At the end of the episode those characters are forgotten about and we move on to next week.
                                                  Patrick Thistle
                                                  Last edited by Patrick Thistle; 19-10-2020, 11:49.

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                                                    Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post
                                                    I stopped watching Who regularly during Peter Capaldi's stint, but yesterday put on an episode to watch. It was called The Magicians Apprentice and was from his second season.

                                                    Anyway (spoilers) it's basically the philosophical question of if you knew a child would grow up to be evil would/ should/ could you kill that child? In this case the child is Davros.

                                                    I've had a couple of thoughts here. One is that modern Who keeps messing with the canon. I know people didn't like River Song much, and the Weeping Angels got seriously overdone by the end, but at least they were new elements to be explored. But going back to long established stories like Davros and retconning them every time is less interesting.

                                                    The second thought was that this story illustrates the fundamental moral problem of having a being who is virtually eternal and can travel through time. Given that he is supposed to be the good guy, the Doctor shrugs off an awful lot of deaths and doesn't act to prevent them happening. How much moral complicity does he take in those deaths? At the end of the episode those characters are forgotten about and we move on to next week.
                                                    In fairness, the Doctor has spoken about hig guilt about people dying in previous episodes, and in one I watched recently Rory said to Matt Smith's Doctor " Your problem is you don't realise how dangerous you are, how people will put themselves in danger just to impress you ".

                                                    While he is a good guy/ woman, the Doctor also has no problem being ruthless. In both " the Shakespeare code" and " The Family of Blood " he imprisons his foes for eternity.

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